closed to open cooling system

[cruiser54]

Pressure bottle and cap failure and no availability of good replacement parts. 

[PCO6]

I can see where the bottle and cap could become a problem.   I replaced one of mine with a Dorman product earlier this year and so far so good.   I generally get my parts from NAPA and the dealership when necessary, plus a bit on line.   I haven't been stumped so far and everything I've got seems to be decent.   Are there some cooling parts that are known to be problems or that are unavailable? 

[velco]

My original bottle (French) lasted 20 years, replaced with a Dorman... lasted 5 years and cracked. Now running a Macs aluminum going on 8 years and all OK on a closed system.

[Minuit]

The cap that my Dorman bottle came with does not hold pressure. Yeah, yeah, Volvo cap, I know. But I'm not going to sink money into a more complicated, more failure prone system that takes up more of my engine bay, that has more hose connections, more plastic under pressure, and is more difficult to purge air from than the alternative. I also hate the goofy heater control valve setup, and I say that as someone who is generally against deleting the heater control valve.

 

Give me a radiator cap and a nonpressurized overflow tank any day of the week. Just like the '91+ fuel injection system, the '91+ cooling system "just @#$%ing works"

[PCO6]

I'm not surprised that some after market parts (Dorman & others) don't last as long or perform as well as OEM parts.  The bottle on my XJ has only been on for about 5-6 months and no leaks ...again ... so far.  I bought a new XJ back in '90 and never had a cooling problem, all OEM of course.  The ABS brakes were another matter.  The final straw was a brake job that cost me 10% of the cost of the vehicle.

 

I have TJ and an LJ as well.  Both are open systems of course and I admit that I prefer that.  They both run fine too.  Funny thing, I just replaced the OEM over flow bottle on the LJ.  It cracked after 15 years and it just sits there.   lol.

[JMO413]

The renix was just before it's time with cooling all newer vehicles have a closed system. IMHO

Mine is closed and works perfectly with a dorman tank and a Napa cap. I will buy a MAC's soon enough beacuse aluminum is always better than plastic.

[PIKE]

I think we are lucky that Macs built a tank for our trucks. Yes expensive, I bought one years ago and don't have to worry any more.

 

http://macsradiatorshop.com/replacment-jeep-radiator-fill-tanks.html

 

You can fill it half way and have a closed system, or use a 2.5 expansion bottle and have an open system. Its that easy. The reason is that the Macs tank is built to use a standard radiator cap. They were thinking about Renix users and created a solution

 

I use mine as an open system with the OEM 2.5 expansion bottle. Works great.

[87MJTIM]

One owner, 32 years, 4th reservoir bottle, lost count of the caps (purchased the Volvo cap - no problems).  I purchased a bottle online once.  C.R.A.P.  Returned it and purchased one from NAPA.

 

Mine has not overheated in years.  Radiator is approx. 20 years old.  While running it on hot days in stop-n-go traffic, the temp gauge does climb above the mid-point on the gauge.  The REM shows engine temp getting up to ~220*F.  The efan switch does not turn on until the engine gets to these higher temps.  My mechanic has suggested that a radiator that old could have clogged/blocked fins.  He recommends changing it.

 

Since I will change the radiator, I want to do what Minuit suggest by cleaning up the engine bay of all the extra hoses.  Open system here I come.

[DirtyComanche]

14 hours ago, PCO6 said:

 Maybe I'm living on borrowed time and should move this up on the list of things to do.

 

Nope.  Long as the pressure bottle looks happy I'd just keep running it.

 

I prefer the closed system, but with lack of radiator availability there's not much point keeping it now.  Cleanest install is to use a new style rad and an old style 2.5L overflow bottle.  Only annoying thing with that is the overflow outlet off the rad points exactly the wrong way, but you can't have everything I guess.

[Minuit]

8 hours ago, PCO6 said:

I'm not surprised that some after market parts (Dorman & others) don't last as long or perform as well as OEM parts.  The bottle on my XJ has only been on for about 5-6 months and no leaks ...again ... so far.  I bought a new XJ back in '90 and never had a cooling problem, all OEM of course.  The ABS brakes were another matter.  The final straw was a brake job that cost me 10% of the cost of the vehicle.

 

I have TJ and an LJ as well.  Both are open systems of course and I admit that I prefer that.  They both run fine too.  Funny thing, I just replaced the OEM over flow bottle on the LJ.  It cracked after 15 years and it just sits there.   lol.

It clearly is working out for you. It works out for most people. It is not even close to working out for me, hence my anger towards it. I admit it is not an inherently flawed system, and it works just fine as long as the parts are in good shape and it's bled properly. If my closed cooling system worked, I sure wouldn't be ripping it all out, but on the other hand, I don't really have any patience for it if it gives me trouble.

 

My closed cooling system happens to be attached to a worn out, neglected truck deep in maintenance debt that alternates overheating and overcooling. I found rusty, muddy looking coolant in it, so as far as I'm concerned everything inside is tainted, and the radiator is quite possibly partially plugged. I have no knowledge of the history of the vehicle before I bought it and for all I know the radiator is days away from springing a major leak anyway (it drips a little bit out of one of the end tanks already). The entire cooling system is suspect, and I'm going to replace all of it. It just happens that the new parts will turn it into an open cooling system.

[WahooSteeler]

1 hour ago, DirtyComanche said:

 

Nope.  Long as the pressure bottle looks happy I'd just keep running it.

 

I prefer the closed system, but with lack of radiator availability there's not much point keeping it now.  Cleanest install is to use a new style rad and an old style 2.5L overflow bottle.  Only annoying thing with that is the overflow outlet off the rad points exactly the wrong way, but you can't have everything I guess.

 

Cleanest and easiest install IMO is to repurpose existing pressure bottle with $5 worth of parts. You don't have to relocate fuel pump ballast resistor or anything else on driver side fender. A couple of clamps and a nylon reducer and the pressure tank becomes the overflow bottle. 

[PCO6]

7 hours ago, DirtyComanche said:

 

Nope.  Long as the pressure bottle looks happy I'd just keep running it.

 

I prefer the closed system, but with lack of radiator availability there's not much point keeping it now.  Cleanest install is to use a new style rad and an old style 2.5L overflow bottle.  Only annoying thing with that is the overflow outlet off the rad points exactly the wrong way, but you can't have everything I guess.

As far as I could tell the pressure bottle in my XJ was the original (30 yrs.) and that's why I replaced it.   I'm about to do my MJ for the same reason.   I also couldn't see what the coolant level was and got tired of using the wooden dowel dip stick I made for it.  

 

I have a NOS closed system radiator in my shed and haven't really paid attention to whether new ones are available.   I'm not opposed to converting to an open system and if the rad supply dries up that would be a pretty good reason!

[PCO6]

12 hours ago, JMO413 said:

The renix was just before it's time with cooling all newer vehicles have a closed system. IMHO

Mine is closed and works perfectly with a dorman tank and a Napa cap. I will buy a MAC's soon enough beacuse aluminum is always better than plastic.

One of my brothers runs a '68 Mini that he converted to a closed system.   I did the same to a '60 MGA many years ago.   Not sure why I did it back then (late '70s) other than some of the "cool guys" had it on their race cars.   

 

I'll take a closer look at my Dorman cap.  it sound like I might want to replace it. 

[PCO6]

EDIT --- I basically stated earlier that the cooling systems on my RENIX era MJ & XJ have been trouble free.   NOT TRUE.   

 

A few years ago I was about to take my MJ in to Krown Rustproofing to be sprayed.  I took it through the car wash the day before to clean the  underside.   It was the first time I did it and I don't plan to do it again.  About a km later the block heater fell out.   It over heated and when I pulled over it was pretty obvious what had happened.  There was a trail of coolant and it was literally dangling by the electrical cord.   I doubt the cord caught on anything and I can't imagine that the water pressure knocked it out.  I've never had that happen before but I've had enough of car washes. 

[velco]

Those block heaters loosen up over time and need to be retightened.  Just look for the coolant crust forming around the perimeter.  I usually do that at every coolant change and use a little plumbers grease on the O ring.  Use a Volvo cap (NAPA p/n 703-1396) on your Dorman bottle or the original French Cap (Lyon France Renault spec) if you still have it.  Eventually you will probably go to the Macs aluminum can, and with that you can run open or closed.  I prefer closed as it runs a little cooler and its a Euro thing.

[rokinn]

12 hours ago, WahooSteeler said:

Cleanest and easiest install IMO is to repurpose existing pressure bottle with $5 worth of parts. You don't have to relocate fuel pump ballast resistor or anything else on driver side fender. A couple of clamps and a nylon reducer and the pressure tank becomes the overflow bottle. 

I dunno, $5 may be a bit of an exaggeration  

 

 

 

[PIKE]

On 8/17/2019 at 7:40 AM, cruiser54 said:

Pressure bottle and cap failure and no availability of good replacement parts. 

 

Cruiser, you have helped me out so much, but there is a good replacement. 

 

http://macsradiatorshop.com/replacment-jeep-radiator-fill-tanks.html

 

This tank allows anyone to keep there closed system or convert to open. Its totally plug in, no modification required if you want to stay with a closed system. Add a 2.5 expansion tank and you have an open system. Its that easy. 

 

don't want to step on any toes because you have helped all of us out so much. 

[cruiser54]

36 minutes ago, PIKE said:

 

Cruiser, you have helped me out so much, but there is a good replacement. 

 

http://macsradiatorshop.com/replacment-jeep-radiator-fill-tanks.html

 

This tank allows anyone to keep there closed system or convert to open. Its totally plug in, no modification required if you want to stay with a closed system. Add a 2.5 expansion tank and you have an open system. Its that easy. 

 

don't want to step on any toes because you have helped all of us out so much. 

 

 

I had one. It's expensive and has no way to see the level without opening it up.

And then it leaked......

A new radiator is $120. Cheaper than the tank. $8 for a recovery bottle and some small line from the radiator neck to that tank and you're done. 

 

[PCO6]

8 hours ago, velco said:

Those block heaters loosen up over time and need to be retightened.  Just look for the coolant crust forming around the perimeter.  I usually do that at every coolant change and use a little plumbers grease on the O ring.  Use a Volvo cap (NAPA p/n 703-1396) on your Dorman bottle or the original French Cap (Lyon France Renault spec) if you still have it.  Eventually you will probably go to the Macs aluminum can, and with that you can run open or closed.  I prefer closed as it runs a little cooler and its a Euro thing.

I've never had one fail before but after having one fall out I added checking it to my maintenance list.   We used to install a lot of them on customer's cars years ago.  Lots of new frost plugs too.   We just used engine oil on the heater gaskets, like installing an oil filter.   

 

Every Jeep I've owned has had a block heater.  I've read that they came standard with Canadian Jeeps.  They appear on the build sheets for each one I currently own.   On most of mine the electrical cord was never even unravelled.   Where you are I'm sure they all were!    

 

I'll get into NAPA this week for a cap.  Not sure about the aluminum can though.   Apart from the price (!) I like to see what's going on … leaks and all. 

[MJPeabody88]

This is my first Jeep. Just did the water pump, thermostat/ housing, power steering pump, and a ton of cleaning. Only the steering pump assembly was necessary. Did everything else for the hell of it. Took my time and after dealing with being given the wrong parts, finally got everything back together. I have a closed system, went through the bleeding process, and couldn’t get it right. Kicking myself for not drilling holes in thermostat. I didn’t fill the radiator through the upper hose, or into the stat housing. I think I have my water pump outlet and heater hose backwards. Just going through the paces of trial and error. (Noob). Started raining. Going to mess with it tomorrow