Death Wobble

[Dammerung]

Just experienced the death wobble again today and now it’s gone from spooky to annoying. I’ve had it for about a month and a half, but haven’t been able to do anything about it until now. I know that none of my steering and suspension components have been replaced except for the steering stabilizer (which was replaced b/c of something non wobble related). I’m gonna try to gather some parts up to get this done sooner or later, but what are the usual main culprits for it and is there any way to diagnose what the issue is?

 

 

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[75sv1]

True DW in neither 'spooky' nor annoying'. Its beyond 'annoying' to be riding a bucking bronco in front of a Semi doing 70 mph. Been there a few times. Stupid me. Still, I would be concerned that your situation does go to DW. Balance tires and check air pressure. Trackbar, ball joints, TREs etc. I'd even check motor mounts. Gearbox tightness, also replace the aluminum spacer with a steel one. 

[Eagle]

7 hours ago, Dammerung said:

 

 I’m gonna try to gather some parts up to get this done sooner or later, but what are the usual main culprits for it and is there any way to diagnose what the issue is?

 

 

The most certain cause is tire balance, but if you have had it for more than a month and you're only just posting about it, I doubt it's death wobble. As 75sv1 noted, death wobble is neither spooky nor annoying -- it's downright terrifying and, when it hits, you can't drive the vehicle. The ONLY thing you can do is stop the vehicle to make the shaking stop.

[75sv1]

     Although my experiences with DW might vary from Eagle's POV in some instances, I will say ' downright terrifying' is right. Nearly jerking the steering wheel out of your hand is close too. I will note, that whatever you are experience might lead to DW in the future. I am wondering if your vehicle is shifting side to side, abruptly or lane change. I'd check the trackbar bushings and mounting.  With larger tires than stock, I went with a WJ steering stabilize shock. Some will say its a mask, or not needed. Also, the Y-link steering has its issues. Might Check Ruffstuff for an item called 'The Cure'. I haven't used it. I'd also look at Kevin's Offroad for items. 

    Although your experience might be termed 'annoying', I wouldn't take it lightly. I had a stock XJ, and it would shift a bit. Usually, I could control it. I was on I70 Toll Road in PA. There were two Ford F450 or so class Pickup next to me in a construction zone, one with a trailer. So, the road was tight fit. I hit a drainage grate. It was either tangle with the trucks or up the hill. Neither a good choice. I held on and kept it under control. 

    Also, check the frame around the steering gear box. On mine, that was one of the issues. Also control arm bushings. One mine the uppers had wear in the sheet metal. 

[Dammerung]

     Although my experiences with DW might vary from Eagle's POV in some instances, I will say ' downright terrifying' is right. Nearly jerking the steering wheel out of your hand is close too. I will note, that whatever you are experience might lead to DW in the future. I am wondering if your vehicle is shifting side to side, abruptly or lane change. I'd check the trackbar bushings and mounting.  With larger tires than stock, I went with a WJ steering stabilize shock. Some will say its a mask, or not needed. Also, the Y-link steering has its issues. Might Check Ruffstuff for an item called 'The Cure'. I haven't used it. I'd also look at Kevin's Offroad for items. 
    Although your experience might be termed 'annoying', I wouldn't take it lightly. I had a stock XJ, and it would shift a bit. Usually, I could control it. I was on I70 Toll Road in PA. There were two Ford F450 or so class Pickup next to me in a construction zone, one with a trailer. So, the road was tight fit. I hit a drainage grate. It was either tangle with the trucks or up the hill. Neither a good choice. I held on and kept it under control. 
    Also, check the frame around the steering gear box. On mine, that was one of the issues. Also control arm bushings. One mine the uppers had wear in the sheet metal. 

I believe it is DW. The steering wheel shakes side to side violently, and my whole truck shakes. The first time it happened I was going 45 down a road, it scared the hell out of me, but I managed to control it by slowing down to 30. It’s happened a few other times but the two different times yesterday were extremely violent, going on for about 15 seconds before I could slow it down to a stop to get it to stop. I can sometimes feel some bump steer that feels like it wants to turn into a DW, but slowing down can help stop it. Whenever I drive it I expect something like this from it now. I’m just lucky that whenever it happened I’ve been alone on the road.


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[WahooSteeler]

Ironically saw this article in my daily Fourwheeler Newsletter email. Not Jeep specific, but still good info. 

 

https://www.fourwheeler.com/how-to/transmission-drivetrain/what-is-death-wobble/?wc_mid=4035:19615&wc_rid=4035:34950555&_wcsid=12CEADA9231090A94F326B305BDD961CB5DEFD91413CBF20

 

[75sv1]

OK, sounds like D. The article posted covers a lot of the culprits. From the pic, it looks like a little larger tires and no lift. ?? I would follow the article to an extent. Check tire pressures. Note if any cords are broke. See to get them balanced. If still, DW, rotate tires. Still DW, will need to check components. I'd probably do this before anything. Possibly an alignment. Mine was doing fine. It was rough aligned. Then I had it aligned and I had DW. I had a lot of new components. I noticed latter one of the TRE tapers was to deep, so lose. I did fix that and still DW. One of the control arm brackets had a wallowed hole, possibly both. I did upgrade from RC to JKS. A bunch of other stuff. For a while no DW. Then it started back again. It actually ripped the track bar bracket at the axle off. If you think DW is bad, doing 55 and then veering right quickly is even worse. Yes, in traffic, but I was in the right lane. I thought I broke the frame. Well, sort of the Issue. I had the bracket welded back on. It broke again. In the end, the frame was cracked near the steering gear box.

         What brand of steering stabilizer do you have? I'm running the OME. Might see if there is play in your present one. Detach one side. Push pull. Shouldn't move much if any. 1/8 most. Also, look into an alignment. They should check components if they are good. What area are you located? Some shops know Jeeps, others don't.

[Dammerung]

Just got an alignment done a few days ago, hoping for a diagnosis on my steering and suspension. Turns out, they’re all still in decent shape, and they just aligned it. I took it past 55mph and she wanted to wobble again. I’m kind of stumped, because I was hoping they’d tell me what was up. The only part now that I know is not working right is the steering stabilizer because I can see the rubber seal sticking out. I don’t think just that stabilizer going could cause DW, but is it still a possibility?


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[JustEmptyEveryPocket]

4 hours ago, Dammerung said:

55mph

This would point me to the tires. When was the last time they were balanced? Follow-up to that question is when was the last time they were balanced by someone who knew what they were doing, cared about their work, and used a quality machine (Road Force balancers FTW)?

[Dammerung]

This would point me to the tires. When was the last time they were balanced? Follow-up to that question is when was the last time they were balanced by someone who knew what they were doing, cared about their work, and used a quality machine (Road Force balancers FTW)?

Only wheel that’s balanced is the spare. Since I pulled it out of the junkyard, I haven’t really dealt with tires other than cleaning the rims they’re on


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[JustEmptyEveryPocket]

Balance them. 

[watchamakalit]

6 hours ago, JustEmptyEveryPocket said:

Balance them. 

X2. Typically a 55mph vibration is a tire issue. don't know what it is about that speed, but it seems to be the magic number for tires.

[Pete M]

in theory the steering stabilizer can help control the side to side vibration (if indeed that is what's happening), but can't cause it when bad.  It's not necessary to the system and lot's of Jeeps don't have them and drive fine. 

[watchamakalit]

I have always felt that steering stablizers are just banaids for bad steering componets until you get into larger tires(33"+).  Just personal opinion.

[Minuit]

You can't rely on a shop for this. No easy way around it - you're going to have to check the condition of the tires as well as every suspension component. The tires, being large, heavy, possibly out of balance spinny things on either end of the axle, are probably the first place you should look. They're the single easiest place for a vibration to develop. I have personally witnessed tires cause death wobble, and some trucks are more tolerant of unbalanced tires than others.

[schardein]

I've experienced DW on my 2000 XJ, any speed over 45mph + hit a bump and DW would commence and not stop until below 15mph.  Installed a new track bar as the joint was questionable, and it pushed the speed up to about 55mph and didn't have to slow as much to recover.  Put on new tires and problem completely went away.

 

I don't know the history of your Comanche, but you said it got pulled out of the junkyard.  How old are the tires?  They are date stamped, google "tire date stamp" if you aren't familiar with how to read them.  If they are over 6 years old, it might be a good idea to just go ahead and replace them.  People in the RV and trailer world are well aware of the need to replace aged tires even if they still "look" good.  Plus, several have already recommended tire balancing as a likely fix.

 

I've experienced DW on two other vehicles, tire related in both cases.  

[Dammerung]

I've experienced DW on my 2000 XJ, any speed over 45mph + hit a bump and DW would commence and not stop until below 15mph.  Installed a new track bar as the joint was questionable, and it pushed the speed up to about 55mph and didn't have to slow as much to recover.  Put on new tires and problem completely went away.
 
I don't know the history of your Comanche, but you said it got pulled out of the junkyard.  How old are the tires?  They are date stamped, google "tire date stamp" if you aren't familiar with how to read them.  If they are over 6 years old, it might be a good idea to just go ahead and replace them.  People in the RV and trailer world are well aware of the need to replace aged tires even if they still "look" good.  Plus, several have already recommended tire balancing as a likely fix.
 
I've experienced DW on two other vehicles, tire related in both cases.  

Took me a minute to find the code because they were on the other sidewall. They were made in the 20th week of 2008. I’m just gonna have to roll with checking the steering components myself and balancing these tires because I can’t afford new ones yet.


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[Minuit]

1 hour ago, Dammerung said:

Took me a minute to find the code because they were on the other sidewall. They were made in the 20th week of 2008.

[schardein]

1 hour ago, Dammerung said:

Took me a minute to find the code because they were on the other sidewall. They were made in the 20th week of 2008. I’m just gonna have to roll with checking the steering components myself and balancing these tires because I can’t afford new ones yet.


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I understand being on a budget.  You might consider used tires if you have used tire sellers near you.  Something less 6 years old would be an improvement over 12-13 year old tires.  Even if you replaced just the front pair, it more than likely will cure the DW.  I don't see if you are 2wd or 4wd, but if 4wd be sure to match tire sizes with the rear.  If you can't replace them right away, pay careful attention to your tire pressures (don't forget to check the spare).

[Pete M]

1 hour ago, Dammerung said:

They were made in the 20th week of 2008.

 

oh my.   the cheapest of cheap tires are better than you have now.  hit up walmart. 

[Minuit]

2 hours ago, Dammerung said:

Took me a minute to find the code because they were on the other sidewall. They were made in the 20th week of 2008. I’m just gonna have to roll with checking the steering components myself and balancing these tires because I can’t afford new ones yet.


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We have members on this site who were barely out of diapers when those tires were made. You've gotta get those replaced if you ever want to drive this truck. Almost anything is probably better than what you've got now. Not to mention what could happen if the tread on those things separates at speed.

 

Start there, and then move on. Don't spend a penny having 12+ year old tires balanced.

[Torq_Shep]

23 minutes ago, Minuit said:

We have members on this site who were barely out of diapers when those tires were made. You've gotta get those replaced if you ever want to drive this truck. Almost anything is probably better than what you've got now. Not to mention what could happen if the tread on those things separates at speed.

 

Start there, and then move on. Don't spend a penny having 12+ year old tires balanced.

Absolutely agree... There are a lot of reasons to replace these tires. I know it is expensive but it is worth it for your safety. 

 

I once inherited a motorcycle with a 1983 front tire... Didn't wait too long to change that out =P

[75sv1]

Might also look around for take offs. Hit up tire shops. Look at online adds. 

[Jaime]

If you want to see a video of what WD looks like and must feel like. Check out Fab Rats YouTube channel under death wobble.

[89 MJ]

13 hours ago, Minuit said:

We have members on this site who were barely out of diapers when those tires were made

I was 4 years old and pounding nails into wood blocks when @Dammerung's tires were made. Its time for them to go. Its not safe for you to drive on old tires like that.