Death Wobble

[87MJTIM]

I purchased a CJ7 several years ago.  The tires were a mix of brands: Michelins and BFG.  Last year, I was trying to determine the age of each tire.  I could not locate the FOUR digit date code on all the tires.  I could find three digit codes, but no four digit codes.  I went to my research source - the internet.  Tire manufacturers used three digit codes prior to 2000!  I was driving tires that were over 20 years old!!!!

 

I fixed that.

[89 MJ]

There are so many issues with that, Tim. I'm glad you didn't die though. Seriously.

[Dammerung]

I was 4 years old and pounding nails into wood blocks when @Dammerung's tires were made. Its time for them to go. Its not safe for you to drive on old tires like that.

I was 5 years old catching frogs when those tires were made. I’m looking into trying to get the front wheels done at least.


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[derf]

I'm having a "get off my lawn" moment.  I have socks older than some of you guys.

 

 

Tires, in an of themselves, do not cause death wobble.  Being out of balance or out of round will cause a shimmy or vibration.  But if the rest of your suspension is in good shape, you won't get death wobble.  Just a noticeable vibration.

 

If your suspension is marginal, the worn out tires can contribute to death wobble.  They can cause it to onset faster or at a lower speed.  But the suspension has to be worn or loose for death wobble to happen regardless of the state of the tires.

 

A steering stabilizer does not fix death wobble.  Replacing and balancing the tires doesn't fix death wobble.  Those two things may mask it and reduce how frequently it happens.  But they don't fix the underlying problem.

 

All of the steering and suspension joints contribute to death wobble.  This includes:

1. Ball joints.  2 at either end of the axle.  Get the Jeep up off the ground and try to move the tire around.  See if the knuckle moves side to side or up and down.  Rotating (i.e. steering) is fine but if it moves around, the ball joints are bad and need to be replaced.
2. Tie rod and drag link ends.  Similar to ball joints, they should rotate but if they move side to side and/or up and down, they're worn and need to be replaced.
3. Link joints.  These are harder to test.  And there's 10 total to check, 4 control arms and 1 track bar.  Though they should all be in similar condition to each other so if you find one that's bad, chances are they're all close to the end of their life.  These you check by grabbing the arm and twisting it around.  It shouldn't move much at all.  The track bar is more of a ball joint type but try moving it around.  If there is excessive play in any of them, you'll get death wobble.

Also check every single fastener with a torque wrench.  I like to do this before I check a specific joint.  A loose bolt will cause excessive play (leading to death wobble all by itself) and you should check the joint when when the bolt/nut is tight.  The ball joints that use cotter pins shouldn't need to be checked if the pin is still there doing its job.

 

Finally, don't trust the monkeys they hire at the alignment shop.  By in large they couldn't identify a bad joint if you crammed it up their nose.  There are some who can but how do you know?

[schardein]

19 hours ago, derf said:

 

All great advice and info.  But, while "tires can't cause death wobble" might be true in theory, strange things happen in real life.  I put new tires on my 2000 XJ, cured the death wobble, drove the rig for another 3 years.  No other maintenance on the front steering/suspension components.  Was taking regular 6 hour interstate trips every other weekend in those days, and the Jeep handled/drove/steered/stopped fine.  Tire replacement cured the death wobble.

 

1979 Chevy K5 Blazer, 3/4 ton axle swap, 5" lift, 35" gumbo monster mudder tires on aluminum rims.  Death wobble so bad the tires were coming off the ground.  Switched out to my old set of 33" Armstrong tires on the stock steel rims, no more death wobble.  Replaced the pretty worn gumbos with new, and no death wobble.  Interestingly enough, about a decade and a half later (with no death wobble during that time) I went to replace the ball joints on this K5 and found the top driver side ball joint was broken.  As in BROKEN IN HALF.  Believe it or not, it actually drove ok.  I was four wheeling and a friend was videoing.  I got the front tires off the ground on a pretty steep climb, and he said the driver front tire was "wobbling".  I laughed it off until I saw the video.  I know exactly when it broke too.  I drove into a snow pile that I thought was powder but turned out to be solid.  Heard the pop but couldn't find anything broken. Found it about 2 years later haha.

 

And I can relate to the socks.  Put on a pair this morning that I've had for 30 years.

[Pete M]

death wobble is a complicated thing 

[Dammerung]

Good News! The DW is fixed... mostly. Just went and had my gnarly old tires balanced for $50 and it accelerated up to 75 no problem. However, when braking, she likes to wobble. Could this be due to the brake rotors? I’m pretty sure they’re warped, because I can feel the pulsation whenever I brake. But I’m not sure if they directly correlate.


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[Jesse J]

that's a possibility actually. does it feel like wobble or vibrate?

[Dammerung]

that's a possibility actually. does it feel like wobble or vibrate?

Feels like wobble. When I brake lightly, it just vibrates, but if I brake heavily, it shakes the whole truck.


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[omega_rugal]

On 1/26/2021 at 10:38 AM, Pete M said:

death wobble is a complicated thing 

 

i suspect it has to do with the relative movemment between the truck and the axle, like the truck wants to go in one direction and the axle pulls in the opposite direction 

[JMO413]

Sounds like rotors to me. If it gets worse the more you apply the brake. 

[1989commanche]

On 1/24/2021 at 12:38 PM, watchamakalit said:

I have always felt that steering stablizers are just banaids for bad steering componets until you get into larger tires(33"+).  Just personal opinion.

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