DirtyComanche

Yeah. Local parts store quoted me like $300 for a reman. I hit RockAuto that night and clicked really hard on the buy button. It was one of their distributor closeout sales, which are normally really good deals, but by the time it gets to me the return period will have passed. Not like I'm sending it back for that price anyways. :laughin:

Yes. Quoted $240, I will pay less. Comes in 10' lengths. It's a backup solution. Basically it's the same stuff used to do big truck and equipment exhaust. If all else fails I will buy it and use it to do from the header to the muffler and have a bunch left over for something else. Do I want to do that? Nope. Would it work? Yup. I threw a Vibrant SS flex coupling in my cart, by the time it gets to me it's still $80. The cheaper Summit ones are NOT actually stainless pipe, just the flex part is. I suppose a guy could cut the pipe off them and just use the flex part to save money? :dunno: 10' of stainless exhaust pipe from the local exhaust shop is quoted at $300. :rotf: Parts store was a lot cheaper, still ugly. It's honestly cheaper for me to just buy the flex hose than it is to buy bends, a flex piece, and pipe to build it the more conventional (and right) way.

Looks like I'm sitting at $1200 CAD to do this. Nothing stainless is cheap. Yeah, I dunno. Doesn't make a lot of sense for a street driven wheeler.

You could install an early GM one. There's actually already one there, at least on my 89, I don't know what it's doing though and didn't feel like going back in the house to get the real wiring manual to find out. Zero mention of it in the Haynes manual.

Renix O2 sensors are 18mmx1.5 thread?

Ah, that is different.

I'm thinking if you pulled it from a junkyard and stole the brake light switch and spacer it would make it a drop in. Might have to splice the wires for the connector if it is different.

It's for firewall clearance primarily, I believe. Like I said, I just rolled the lip on mine to fix it. The pedal possibly is a little higher, but my pedals, seat, and floor are modded, so it's apples to bananas. Either my reman had the wrong rod in it, or you need the (later) adjustable brake light switch. I wound up grinding the rod a bit (too much) and then modified my switch to be adjustable. This added considerable time and I see zero mention of it anywhere else (it was a total surprise to me), so there's a good chance that my cheap reman was at least partly to blame. Edit, and if I wasn't a numpty I would have ground the rod correctly and saved a lot of time. Seriously, I own thousands of dollars of precision measuring equipment, and professionally work on critical components where tolerances are called out in tenths, and I chose to eyeball modifying the rod. :doh:

Use a booster/master from a 95-96 XJ with the 1/4" spacer plate on your 91. Much easier, pure PnP, and works just as well. I put mine on without a spacer. I just had to roll the lip on the firewall a bit. There isn't good yards here for pulling things, so I ordered the whole booster off Rockauto for $19 or something (reman). I did have to modify things a bit to make the brake light switch work. Or maybe work. I should check that it's actually doing something still. :eek:

Welding SS exhaust isn't rocket science. No TIG here. Last one I did I used my stick welder, actually. :rotf: I honestly don't care how it looks, I just care that it doesn't rust. I hate rust. Real bad. If I ever built a Jeep Jeep I would just phone Aqualu for the entire body. Luckily (maybe?) I'm not terribly into normal Jeeps. I called the local parts house for some SS flex hose, and they've got 10' set aside for me. I'm going to order some other parts, but that will be a backup if things aren't going to work out. I do not believe in any style of clamp joint other than V-bands or donuts. I would not use a clamp on O2 bung. I might do suspect work, and it might take me a long time, but it's always welded together in a manner that won't come apart.

Oh absolutely. Believe it or don't, there's whole books dedicated to leaf spring design and I don't think any of them would recommend a shackle near that length for springs of that length and curvature. Not to say it doesn't work.

Yes. Among other things. The sch system is sizing only, and I believe even the plastic (PVC/ABS/etc) pipe is actually the same dimensions as the steel pipe.

The one I linked originally is listed for TJ/YJ/ZJ/XJ of the HO type, but who knows what it will actually fit. I do not have driveshaft clearance issues with the exhaust (pinion is about 5" farther to the driver's side due to the axle that's in it). I don't know what else would be an issue, the firewall?

can you explain whats going on with that shackle? something doesn't look right.... They're these: http://www.ironman4x4fab.com/Products/RLS.html You can thread them in or out to adjust the length... Kinda nifty. Rather long.

Yes. Ruff Stuff would be my go to. Ballistic is a last resort, to the point that if only they have it, I probably don't need it, since they probably aren't going to ship it anyways...

I joined in 2005. I missed my 10 year anniversary.

Yeah, I'm not sure what I'm going to do actually... I had a flex joint somewhere around where yours is the last time I built one of these, worked well, but this is all getting weird on me. Either I'm going to abandon this (and scab what was there back together) because the potential cost is getting out of hand, or I will go all in. I'm thinking I might cut the existing flange off the header and weld a V-band flange on it. Why? Because I know it will seal then, and I know it will fit. From there just buy a couple U bends and a flex joint and start building it. This will be really time consuming. It will be costly too. That 'cheap' header is still $250 by the time it gets to me. Figure another $100 for the V-band setup. Then about $80 for bends. Another $100 for pipe (sourced locally I hope). Then I can either drop $400 for a pre-made catback and hope it fits, or buy more bends and a muffler... Hmm.

And before anyone else says anything, design matters more than materials by a factor of 100:1. People went to the moon in something made out of aluminum foil.

Terrible generalization and pretty much just 'wrong.' If we were talking ABS or PVC, yeah, sure. Steel? No. ASTM-A53 standards are for structural rated pipe that is made from carbon steel, and they spec very similar in mechanical properties to A37 steel. You probably see A37 steel in use all the time as angle iron, flat bar, channel, H beams (W-flange), and many other structural steel shapes. ASTM-A53B is actually stronger than A37 by some 10-15%, IIRC. Note, these standards are not as strong as DOM, which is about 100% stronger, depending on exact grade. Steel pipe also comes in other standards for other applications. I don't want to talk about that, because there is a lot of them, and while some are useful and many are not (you can buy T-304 stainless pipe, it's useful for some things, but pretty irrelevant to this conversation). Pipe that is built to a standard will have that inked down the length of it, or tagged, or bundled. Places like Homedepot will probably sell ASTM-A53 pipe, but they may not, go to a real steel yard and you will get the correct type (they typically will not carry any non standard steel pipe as their customers have no use for it). The ASTM-A53 pipe is also very similar to many of the HREW/ERW tubing standards. Pipe sizing is odd, as it is a carryover from 'old times'. You basically need a pipe size table to know what the hell it is. The ones I use most are 1.5" sch40 (pronounced 'schedule 40' and it refers to the thickness of the wall), which is something like 1.92" OD and .145" wall thickness, giving something around a 1.5" inside diameter (how they're actually sizing it), and 1.5" sch80 (thicker wall) and 1.25" sch40/80 and 1" sch40/80. I keep short lengths of the smaller stuff around to use for making sleeves and bushings, it isn't much use for anything else. A pipe bender and dies are for bending pipe, but most of the cheap ones need work to actually function correctly. Generally they're way too wide, and will cause flattening (which is not desirable), so the inside of the dies are best welded up and ground smooth to tighten them a bit. Also the rollers are normally a terrible design and will cause denting, guys replace them with angle iron and other bits, but that's up to you. As to roll cage construction, since somebody brought it up, it's fairly common in the offroad world for HREW/ERW tubing to be used for cage construction. Typically 1.5"x.120 or 1.75"x.120 for a midsized vehicle. 1.25" sch40 pipe is stronger than 1.5"x.120 ERW due to the large dimensions (both OD and wall thickness), and 1.5" sch40 is stronger than 1.75"x.120 ERW for the same reason. That said, SHOULD you be building the majority of a cage from any of these materials? Probably not, but it happens. I see little harm in building certain less critical pieces from them though. The main hoops and "driver safety critical areas" should always be DOM or like material, IMHO. Anyways, in summary, pipe can be used in many places structurally as long as you realize it is what it is. Hopefully somebody actually reads that, rather than having their eyes glaze over and skipping it. It took me a while to type.

If you're going to use a metal brush on aluminum, brass is the preferred type.

Yeah, that was my plan if I didn't get an actual HO downpipe. Summit has them. Cheap, easy. Any ideas if that flange from Summit for 2.5" pipe will fit???

Oh? Well that makes it easier. There's not many parts of the stock exhaust pipe that haven't been massaged to fit it seems, so I always ASSumed it was 2.25".

Actually an XJ thing, but it's the same for what matters in this case. 89, Renix, 4.0L Factory exhaust is scabbed, broken, doesn't fit right, has a 'newer' catback on it that's totally rotten because it was bare steel. Anyways, Renix parts are always harder to come by, and seem to be a premium. So I was thinking I'd massage the intake and install this header: http://www.amazon.com/Wrangler-Cherokee-Performance-Stainless-Polished/dp/B00JA1BGYY?ie=UTF8&psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=ox_sc_act_title_1&smid=A1F86TF7G43XA2 Any experience with it? Reading the reviews on Amazon is mixed. The flange thickness issue is well, an issue, but it can be dealt with by making some custom washers. Obviously there also isn't a bung for my O2 sensor, but on to that... Who makes a stainless downpipe, or 'front pipe' as it seems to be called by exhaust manufacturers, that will fit an HO and have the bung in it? Failing that, does anyone know what flange style can be bolted to an HO header? These maybe? http://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/vpe-1471/overview/(they sell individually also) Is there a flare piece on Summit that will fit the needed donut gasket? Closest I think I can find is for 2.5" pipe: http://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/vpe-2599/overview/ If I have to use that (if it would fit on the header and seal) I would neck it down to 2.25" right away. I do not have any issues with front driveshaft clearance but will have trouble fitting larger pipe from there back. Unfortunately 2.25" parts seem to be much rarer than 2.5". I can buy some U-bends and make the exhaust from the header back if I know what flange and flare will bolt up. Otherwise I'm at a bit of a loss. Buying a weld in bung for the O2 isn't a big deal. I can get everything from there back easily enough if I just buy normal universal parts. Yes, I can weld stainless well enough.

Well, it would probably be about as useful as the OEM part then. I've purchased some Omix stuff, nothing seemed too bad about it... :dunno:

I think you can get them on Rockauto for $70 (Omix-Ada)... They aren't worth that to me, I think they're just a goofy concept that gets in the way of everything.