5x5 bolt pattern with WJ swap

[saveevryjp1998]

As soon as I sent that it made me think of the Reid knuckle setup. The jk uses the same part number as the others so it has to work and probably by simply swapping the lower ball joint like the wj. I dunno why I'm a glutton for punishment but I'm going to try to buy a passenger knuckle and give it a shot or at least for numbers. I will say I'm pretty sure they cheaped out on the jk vs the wj iirc they are known for failure and not as beef. Either way it looks like a $75 distraction from crazy virus that's spreading due to covid fear.

 

I also wonder why nobody has ever experimented with Chevy knuckles as well since the Reid basically is. I've always sensed there were way more options but around the time this became a thing, 1 tons kinda exploded and became way more common obviously because of cost and availability. Those 2 factors however seem to be changing due to demand and I've had inquires once again on the knuckles so I guess we'll see if people start building more setups like this.

[saveevryjp1998]

So the answer seams to be yes and no. Also crickets on said mentioned kit. At this point I'm at a firm no. The wj setup is pretty sweet and from what I can already see at least around 1/2 less cost than jk. I hope that helps "steer" you in the right direction swampy.

[ghetdjc320]

6 hours ago, saveevryjp1998 said:

So the answer seams to be yes and no. Also crickets on said mentioned kit. At this point I'm at a firm no. The wj setup is pretty sweet and from what I can already see at least around 1/2 less cost than jk. I hope that helps "steer" you in the right direction swampy.

The regular moog problem saver ball joints should take care of that issue. Or adjustable control arms. The interesting thing with the Reid knuckles is if they had the standard old d44 spindle mounts so we could swap to different bolt patterns easily. The stock brakes on a WJ are slightly better than the JK in both piston surface are and pad swept surface. I wish Reid still made the d30/44 TJ knuckles. It was a perfect way to swap in locking hubs, 6x5.5 wheel pattern, d154 calipers and any steering you want. Perfect complement for a rodeo/passport rear. I'm really trying to find out what knuckles would bolt on to a xj D30 and offer different caliper mounting/unit bearing options. 

[saveevryjp1998]

1 hour ago, ghetdjc320 said:

The regular moog problem saver ball joints should take care of that issue. Or adjustable control arms. The interesting thing with the Reid knuckles is if they had the standard old d44 spindle mounts so we could swap to different bolt patterns easily. The stock brakes on a WJ are slightly better than the JK in both piston surface are and pad swept surface. I wish Reid still made the d30/44 TJ knuckles. It was a perfect way to swap in locking hubs, 6x5.5 wheel pattern, d154 calipers and any steering you want. Perfect complement for a rodeo/passport rear. I'm really trying to find out what knuckles would bolt on to a xj D30 and offer different caliper mounting/unit bearing options. 

It cannot be corrected by control arms but you could with more expensive offset ball joints which is what I meant by further limitations, cost increase, and just as technical install. It also sounds like the possibility of a braking performance slightly less than a wj. All that definitely makes me stick to proven, efficient, cheaper, and more easily sourced wj knuckle over the jk. Fyi it appears the Autozone are no longer selling moog 3 yr warranty hubs or at least what's left at certain stocked stores. Duralast seems to be the push around here with same cost and only a 1 year warranty. I understand nearly most parts are the same with different boxes from same manufacturer but guys need to see is the quality is dropping and so is the warranties. I constantly keep an eye on the box chains since the trend is horribly getting worse. 

[Sir Sam]

8 hours ago, saveevryjp1998 said:

Can you get a measurement between the knuckle ears for upper and lower ball joint holes on the JK knuckle. The wj lower ball joint must be swapped in the xj lower place for the swap to work with wj. I've done it. Supposedly guys say they haven't and it destroys the knuckle fairly quick which I'm guessing makes perfect sense because it obvious it shouldn't fit. I'm not sure if it's as obvious from your link though. It's been several years since I did it. I actually never finished it because I was hunting down low clearance zerk fittings which could easily bypass that hiccup but I wanted it my way and that's it. The truck ended up parted but I still have it. I'm about to start on it again though and a second 1 I picked up a month ago. I do have 1 more set of wj knuckles ready however I'm rather curious about jk brakes and rotors vs wj. I've never had the chance to see or study the difference if any to see which may be better. I do know the jk route, if it's even bolt on, will not be cheaper unless you have the parts for free. Yards want way too much for the newer stuff. 

ya I can get a measurement. I have an XJ d30 here with knuckles off and the Jk d44 here with knuckles off. 
 

I actually bought a new JK knuckle to complete my axle, I picked up an 8k mile JK d44 over ten years ago, but it was missing the knuckle, saw you can get aftermarket these days reasonably priced. 

[Sir Sam]

I think most of this is pretty much moot. Any day of the week there are a dozen JKs in the yards, and probably a few with the akebono brakes. 
 

I’m disappointed to hear the JK brakes seem to be a little sub par compared to WJ. 

[saveevryjp1998]

28 minutes ago, Sir Sam said:

I think most of this is pretty much moot. Any day of the week there are a dozen JKs in the yards, and probably a few with the akebono brakes. 
 

I’m disappointed to hear the JK brakes seem to be a little sub par compared to WJ. 

You are lucky. I am yet to see a jk hit a chain yard around here or small yard or at least up until last year. The lkq linked places get them along with the specialty part out yards. I'm sure there has been rare times but I've never been that fortunate enough to stumble on it yet. That stuff is high dollar, sells down to the last bolt usually, and more often sell whole for rebuilt titles whenever possible still for ridiculous money. I've seen the eBay sets you might be referring to as cheap. They also are China if you dig deeper without good or any seller reviews. There are some though that look reputable at 80 roughly per side with free shipping. That's still too much and more than much easier sourced wj parts. 

[Sir Sam]

4 hours ago, saveevryjp1998 said:

You are lucky. I am yet to see a jk hit a chain yard around here or small yard or at least up until last year. The lkq linked places get them along with the specialty part out yards. I'm sure there has been rare times but I've never been that fortunate enough to stumble on it yet. That stuff is high dollar, sells down to the last bolt usually, and more often sell whole for rebuilt titles whenever possible still for ridiculous money. I've seen the eBay sets you might be referring to as cheap. They also are China if you dig deeper without good or any seller reviews. There are some though that look reputable at 80 roughly per side with free shipping. That's still too much and more than much easier sourced wj parts. 

 

haha no, that was a typo. I mean a dozen WJs. 
 

I do see Jks on occasion, but they are usually really phucked up. I did see a rubicon recently. Someone snagged the rear before I could and the front was in a number of pieces. 

[ghetdjc320]

Really wish we knew what knuckle alternatives exist for changing wheel bolt patterns. I’d like to find 6x5.5

[saveevryjp1998]

5 hours ago, Sir Sam said:

 

haha no, that was a typo. I mean a dozen WJs. 
 

I do see Jks on occasion, but they are usually really phucked up. I did see a rubicon recently. Someone snagged the rear before I could and the front was in a number of pieces. 

I don't go near heaps like that. Too much bad mojo for my blood.

[Pete M]

I've seen exactly 3 TJs in 'yards.  no JKs yet.   

[omega_rugal]

search for complete but broken trucks, strip what you need, sell the rest as scrap, you must invest more at first but you can get some profit in the end

 

of course you need room to put the truck while you strip it...

[Swampy]

This took off more than I was expecting it to. Its good to know you can use wj hubs to run the 5x5 bolt pattern. 

[ghetdjc320]

@75sv1 just a quick recap, I’m looking at running 5x5 pattern on my HP30. Did you use WJ hubs with the 1/4” spacer on XJ knuckles? If so, what rotors did you use?

[75sv1]

I am running the WJ Big Brakes. So, WJ knuckles with a 1/4 spacer. Then using the WJ Akebono Calipers. I also need to space out 1/4 for the Brake Caliper bracket. On mine with 5 on 5, I use WJ Rotors. That is with the WJ Hub Bearings. Also, use WJ lower ball joints. I see a lot of threads going in different directions. Some of them scare me. If people need a list or so. I'll post more info. 

[ghetdjc320]

33 minutes ago, 75sv1 said:

I am running the WJ Big Brakes. So, WJ knuckles with a 1/4 spacer. Then using the WJ Akebono Calipers. I also need to space out 1/4 for the Brake Caliper bracket. On mine with 5 on 5, I use WJ Rotors. That is with the WJ Hub Bearings. Also, use WJ lower ball joints. I see a lot of threads going in different directions. Some of them scare me. If people need a list or so. I'll post more info. 

Good to know. I’m curious if we could use WJ hubs directly on XJ/Mj knuckles for the 5x5 pattern with appropriately drilled/sourced rotors without swapping to the other WJ components. I’m running a big brake kit at the moment with wk2 calipers. I need to see if I can find someone a the parts store that will let me measure some different options. 

[75sv1]

I have gone that route. Also, I think you would be running the early XJ knuckles. Cobra Marty had some write ups about that. I think he went even larger diameter rotor. I remember Dodge Dakota Rotors. Mustang GT calipers and 3/4 spacers. I want to say he used XJ hub bearings. The WJs are basically the same, except the 5 on 5. I use Rock Auto to get dimensions. 

     I was/ am looking to use WJ Hubs, Dakota Rotors or later Jeep rotors to get a 13 inch rotors and use WJ hubs. I might try and go to 5 on 5.5. Thinking on of the later JKs or such would have the hubs etc.  

[ghetdjc320]

31 minutes ago, 75sv1 said:

I have gone that route. Also, I think you would be running the early XJ knuckles. Cobra Marty had some write ups about that. I think he went even larger diameter rotor. I remember Dodge Dakota Rotors. Mustang GT calipers and 3/4 spacers. I want to say he used XJ hub bearings. The WJs are basically the same, except the 5 on 5. I use Rock Auto to get dimensions. 

     I was/ am looking to use WJ Hubs, Dakota Rotors or later Jeep rotors to get a 13 inch rotors and use WJ hubs. I might try and go to 5 on 5.5. Thinking on of the later JKs or such would have the hubs etc.  

That’s right. I’m running pre 90 knuckles with late model XJ HP30. I’m using 14’ GC calipers and brackets on 04’ Explorer rotors. I’m also interested in going to a 13” rotor. It’s a tricky part of my built atm as I try to sort wheel size, backspacing, brakes and steering. I’m running a KJ 8.25 rear with disks which is 63” wms. The track width is great in back as it fills out the wheel wells much nicer. Currently I have 1.25 spacers for the front to match the overall wms of the back but not sure if I’ll keep it that way. Looking for some wheels with the right bolt pattern and backspacing (around 5”). The tire debate is endless as well. Trying to go with at least metric 32’s but 33’s are a possibility if I go notch flares… too many options 

[Greenjeans]

Sorry I’m not much help.  I used wheel spacer/adapters on mine.  ‘99 HP D30, WJ knuckles, JK wheels.  Weld on 1/4” spacers.  

[ghetdjc320]

3 hours ago, Greenjeans said:

Sorry I’m not much help.  I used wheel spacer/adapters on mine.  ‘99 HP D30, WJ knuckles, JK wheels.  Weld on 1/4” spacers.  

What lift height are you running?

[Greenjeans]

My measurements have me right at 4” but it’s all junk yard parts so it may not be exact.  They are Rusty’s 305 front springs out of a junked TJ.

[ghetdjc320]

So ultimately the question still remains. Perhaps we can put this to rest once and for all. Has anyone just installed WJ unit bearings on the XJ/MJ knuckle to accomplish the 5x5 bolt pattern? Not swapping on the WJ knuckles, steering or brakes, just the unit bearing. We know the spline count fits, we know it fits inside the XJ knuckle but the question is does it center the u joint when installed on that knuckle. Or is a spacer required to bump it out? 

[neohic]

16 hours ago, ghetdjc320 said:

So ultimately the question still remains. Perhaps we can put this to rest once and for all. Has anyone just installed WJ unit bearings on the XJ/MJ knuckle to accomplish the 5x5 bolt pattern? Not swapping on the WJ knuckles, steering or brakes, just the unit bearing. We know the spline count fits, we know it fits inside the XJ knuckle but the question is does it center the u joint when installed on that knuckle. Or is a spacer required to bump it out? 

I think the spacer is required to keep the ball joints and the u joint in the shaft assembly aligned properly. A long while back I had all the parts sitting around that I started bolting it all together to see what’s what. It all physically went together, but there was binding in the joints when rotating through a turn. I never had the setup on the road though… only mocked on jack stands. 

[ghetdjc320]

What’s interesting is that the WJ conversion using WJ knuckles still uses XJ/MJ unit bearings. Since the only thing changing is the knuckle, it would be logical that the 1/4” spacer is used to correct the knuckle and not the unit bearing. That would make it seem like a wj 5x5 pattern could be had simply by replacing the unit bearing with the WJ version but keeping the XJ knuckles. Someone just needs to get one and try it 

[ghetdjc320]

Here are the general specs for the 2004 WJ, XJ (99.5+), 2007 JK, 1992 XJ, and 88 MJ unit bearings (in that order)
 

Stands out right away that the JK unit bearing need 32 spline outers.