How well do rear XJ fender flares fit the MJ?

[jage]

I know the fronts are the same - what about the rear?

[CWLONGSHOT]

I haven"t put them side by side, but I have herd that the MJ's are different than the XJ for the rears......

 

CW

[Eagle]

I have put them side-by-side. Not even close. There was another thread a couple of three weeks back where I posted actual measurements, but the MJ flares are something like 2" or 3" longer (front to back) and about 2" higher than rear XJ flares. The only way to make XJ flares work would be to graft in a section of the quarter panel from a 2-door XJ, to get the smaller arch opening.

 

Here it is. Scroll down almost to the end for the measurements.

http://comancheclub.com/forums/viewtopi ... s&start=15

[DirtyComanche]

Yeah, I didn't believe Eagle. Then I went out and put the MJ fenders on the XJ....

[Frankensteinsmj]

I think I read somewhere that the flares from a 4 door xj around the same vintage will work.

[Eagle]

I think I read somewhere that the flares from a 4 door xj around the same vintage will work.

You can make anything work if you try hard enough. But they are not the same, and they don't fit. The rear flares on the MJs are both longer and higher than XJ flares. All XJ rear flares are the same, the 2-door and the 4-door don't use different flares.

[89MJComanche]

wow.

 

lots of bad info in this post.

 

 

2 Door XJ flares are the same as MJ flares.

 

4 door XJ flares have a slightly smaller rear flare to fit around the rear door. The will not work by bolting up directly.

 

However if you chop up anything will work

[pingpong]

wow.

 

lots of bad info in this post.

 

 

2 Door XJ flares are the same as MJ flares.

 

4 door XJ flares have a slightly smaller rear flare to fit around the rear door. The will not work by bolting up directly.

 

However if you chop up anything will work

 

I can tell you from experince the rear 4 door ones will not fit and look right. I am not sure on the 2 door Xj's cause I have never tried, and my rig no longer has a bed.

 

I can tell you I have seen the 2dr XJ bushwacker flairs on a MJ, and they looked all right.

[Eagle]

wow.

 

lots of bad info in this post.

 

 

2 Door XJ flares are the same as MJ flares.

 

4 door XJ flares have a slightly smaller rear flare to fit around the rear door. The will not work by bolting up directly.

 

However if you chop up anything will work

There's bad info here, all right, and it's all in your post. I have a pair of flares ON the rear quarter panels that I cut off a 2-door XJ. They are exactly the same size and profile as the flares on my 4-door XJ. And they are smaller in both height and length than the flares on an MJ. Those measurements I linked to were taken from one of MY MJs, and from the set of 2-door XJ quarter panels I have.

 

I don't know where you got your information, but this is one time when I KNOW you're wrong. If it'll paste in, the following is directly from the factory parts book:

Item |. . . Part # . . . | Qua | Body | Model | Description

1-2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . APPLIQUE, Rear Quarter, P.A.R.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

. . . . . 5501 3612-3 . . 1 . . . XJ . . . . . . . . . 1987-89

. . . . . 5AG24-5 JX9 . . 1 . . . XJ . . . . . . . . . 1990, Flat Black, P.A.R.

. . . . . 5AG18-9 JX8 . . 1 . . . XJ . . . . . . . . . 1990, Gloss Black

. . . . . 5501 3614-5 . . 1 . . . MJ . . . . . . . . . 1987-89

. . . . . 5AG28-9 JX9 . . 1 . . . MJ . . . . . . . . . 1990, Flat Black, P.A.R.

. . . . . 5AG26-7 JX8 . . 1 . . . MJ . . . . . . . . . 1990, Gloss Black

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3-4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . PANEL, Inner Protective

. . . . . 5500 4032-3 . . 1 . . . XJ

. . . . . 5500 6176-7 . . 1 . . . MJ

Notice that none of the MJ part numbers match any of the MJ part numbers. Notice also that there is only ONE inner liner listed for the XJ, and it isn't the same number as the one for the MJ.

[Pete M]

:needpics:

 

 

No matter how much I said Dakota rear lights were different than MJ lights, it wasn't until I took pics of both side by side that XJ owners stopped arguing the point. :nuts:

[Frankensteinsmj]

I can see what I started. I said "think I read" oh well, I've read so much and ol age is setting in. I thought I read it at the jeepforum site. go figure! I just pulled one of mine to sand blast some rot out and all the nuts snapped due to rust. so its off to the j yard I guess.

[Frankensteinsmj]

Here is what I read: might help some but might start new debates?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Well, I just now finished up making the stock specs, hope everything is in order.

 

Common Design

 

All MJs were built as a full unibody design with the body and frame rails tied/welded together as one piece and cannot be removed, however, the rear is a fully boxed frame with the bed bolted to it, making the bed removable. All MJs have solid axles front and rear. The suspension consists of coils for the front and leaf springs for the rear. All MJs came with disc brakes in the front and drums in the rear.

 

Also, all MJ's through all years are equipped with a height sensing proportioning valve that is used to change the bias of the brakes if the bed had a load in it.

 

For those curious to the differences in Cherokee's and Comanche's:

 

The taillight lenses are different from a Cherokee's, the wheel flares are the same (as a 2dr Cherokee), hoods are swappable from 84-92 models Cherokee's (Cherokee's above 92 used spring-loaded hinges), and all mechanical/electronic parts forward of the firewall ARE identical.

 

Body

 

The body comes only in standard cab model with a rear double-top hatch tailgate. Comes in longbed or shortbeds two-tone versions. Long bed versions come with a larger gas tank than the short bed and is located front of the axle. Short bed version was not avaiable in 1986.

 

Interior: Door panels are removable as stock. Bench seats and bucket seats DO NOT have the same mounting brackets as XJ seats. Gauge cluster is removed by 4 screws. Gauge cluster during 86' have mechanical-powered gauges. On 87-90 gauges, The speedometer uses a cable, but all gauges 91-92 use a computer cable.

 

Wheelbase:

 

short bed 2wd=113.1 4wd=112.9 (18 gal tank)

long bed 2wd=119.6 4wd=119.4 (16 gal [longbed, opt shortbed] 23.5 gal [opt longbed; standard from 1989])

 

Engines

 

2.5L I4 TBI (fuel injected) - 117 hp @ 5000 rpm, 135 ftlb @ 3500 rpm - used in 86 and updated in 87-90 to 121hp (2.5L became MPI in 91 and was rated for 130hp @ 5250 and 149 ftlb @ 3250)

 

GM 2.8L V6 - 115 hp @ 4800 rpm, 145 ft lb @ 2400 rpm - used only in 86

 

Italian VM 2.8L Turbo Diesel - 140 hp, 236 ft lb torque - used in overseas MJs

 

2.1L 4 cylinder Turbo Diesel - 85 hp, 132 ft lb torque.

 

4.0L I6 EFI "Power Tech" - 177 hp @ 4750 rpm, 220 ft lb @ 4000 rpm - used 87-90

4.0L I6 MPI "Power Tech HO" (High Output) - 190 hp @ 4750 rpm, 220 ft lb @ 4,000 rpm - used in 91-92

 

Transmissions

 

Manual Transmissions

AX4 - 4 speed manual - manufactured by Aisin - used 86-92 with 2.5L I4 and 2.8L V6 engines and 2.8L turbo-diesels

T4 & T5 - 4 & 5 speed manual - manufactured by Borg Warner - used only in 86 with 2.5L I4 and 2.8L V6 engines

AX5 - 5 speed manual - manufactured by Aisin - used with 2.8L V6 and 87+ with 2.5L I4

AX15 - 5 speed manual - manufactured by Aisin - used with 4.0L I6 engines

 

Automatic Transmissions

Torqueflight 904 - 3 speed automatic - used only in 86 with 2.8L V6 and 2.5L I4 engines and 2.8L turbo-diesels

AW4 - 4 speed automatic, electronically controlled - manufactured by Aisin - used from 87-92 (87-92 models include a Power/Comfort button that adjusts the shift points, also known as a towing package; all transmissions came with the towing package and came with a transmission cooler; 88+ models used Power/Comfort switch for off-roading)

 

Pete M implied information about this that might override anything written above, where his information is correct. It was too hard for me to take his info and add it in, atleast for now...

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete M

The "Metric Tonne" or "Big Ton" or "payload package" was designed for hauling, was only available on longbeds, and consisted of an AMC-20 rear axle in 86, Dana 44 rear axle in 87-92, heavier duty springs front and rear, tougher shocks, the larger tires, fullsize spare and 15x7 wheels. In the AMC-20, the only gear ratio was 4.10, Dana 44s got stuck with the standard ratio available with the specified drivetrain combo (3.08 for 4.0l/manual, 3.54 for 4.0l/autos, and 4.09 for 2.5l/manuals).

 

 

Transfer Cases

 

 

The transfer cases used are all chain driven with aluminum housings. NP stands for "New Process" which is the brand, if you will.

NP207 - "Command-Trac" part-time only - 2.61:1 ratio low range - used 86

NP231 - "Command-Trac" part-time only - 2.72:1 ratio low range - shift pattern 2H - 4H - N - 4L - used 87-92

NP228 - "Select-Trac" part-time OR full-time - 2.6:1 ratio low range - used 86

NP242 - "Selec-Trac" part-time OR full-time - 2.72:1 ratio low range - shift pattern 2wd - 4part-time - 4full-time - N - 4LO - used 87-92

 

Driveshafts

 

Front Driveshaft - On 86-87 MJs (NP207 t-case) the front shaft is a "GKN" style shaft. On 87-92 MJs (NP231/242 t-case) the front is a "double cardan" two-piece driveshaft with a CV joint at the transfer case end.

 

Rear Driveshaft - The rear is a one-piece shaft with standard u-joints at both ends. The slip yoke is located on the output shaft of the transfer case. On 86-92 models, the yoke slides in and out of the transfer case and is lubricated by the ATF fluid internally.

 

This information might override what's written on the rear-driveshaft, but has no method of being added in as 'stock'

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete M

Actually, there were 2 different styles of rear shaft offered, though I have yet to determine a logical pattern behind which MJ got which. The other one was a 2-piece design, but not the usual 2-piece you're thinking of where one side slips on the other. The MJ 2-piece had a large outer tube on the transmission side and a smaller tube on the axle side. They are fused together with a thick rubber isolator designed to reduce vibrations.

 

 

Axles

 

Front Axles

 

Dana 30 high pinion - reverse cut - 27 spline, 1.16" diameter shafts, 7.13" ring gear - used 86-92 (all axles are vacuum disconnect, and have 5-260x u-joints)

 

Rear Axles

 

AMC-20 - 29 Spline, one piece axle shafts, 8.875" Ring Gear; Metric Tonne axle in 86.

Dana 35 non c-clip - 27 spline, 1.18" diameter shafts, 7.58" ring gear, 2.62" axle tube - used 86-89

Dana 35 c-clip - 27 spline, 1.18" diameter shafts, 7.58" ring gear, 2.62" axle tube - used 89-92

Dana 44 non c-clip - 30 spline, 1.31" diameter shafts, 8.5" ring gear, 2.75" axle tube - used 87-89 on some(not all) MJs equipped with towing package.

(note for D44's: All MJ's equipped with the stock D44 come with the Metric Ton Package)

 

All rear axles are made of a spring under axle design.

 

Gearing

 

3.07 - used with 4.0L engine / manual transmission

3.55 - used with 4.0L engine / automatic transmission

4.10 - used with 2.5L engine usually

4.56 - rare but can be found on some older (~ 89 ~) models with 2.5L engine and auto transmission

 

NOTE by Pete M:

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete M

in 86 there was a "fuel saver" package where you could get a 3.31 ratio. (that package also came with the 2.5L, 4 speed manual transmission, and tailgate delete)

 

 

Cooling Systems

 

Open style - any normal cooling system used today. Opposite of closed style described below.

 

Closed style - has no radiator cap and utilizes a pressure bottle. This style cooling system was used in 87-90 MJs.

 

Airbags

 

No airbags during Comanche timeline.

 

Trim Levels

 

86 - Custom, X, XLS

87 - Base, Pioneer, Chief, Laredo, SporTruck

88 - Base, Pioneer, Chief, Laredo, Eliminator, SporTruck

89 - Base, Pioneer, Chief, Laredo, Eliminator, SporTruck

90 - Base, Pioneer, Chief, Laredo, Eliminator, SporTruck

91 - Base, Laredo, Eliminator, SporTruck

92 - Base, Laredo, Eliminator, SporTruck

 

Production Numbers

 

MJ (4x4 only)

 

SWB/LWB

1986 23,251/xxxxx

1987 6,199/6,685

1988 6,895/9,167

1989 5,354/5,021

1990 3,283/2,129

1991 5,188 (TOTAL)

1992 3,142 (TOTAL)

 

A little info on dimensions:

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete M

Overall length was 179.3" for shortbeds, 194.0" for longbeds

Overall curb height was 63.7" for 2wds, 64.7" for 4wds

Track width was 57" with the 15x6 rims, 58" with the 15x8s

Body width at the rear flares was 71.7"

Length of inside of box at the floor was 73.7" sb and 88.5" lb

Width of box at the floor is 55.3" for both sb and lb

Width between wheel wells is 43.8"

Box depth is 16.4"

 

 

This is a edited copy of the XJ stock specs. If anything here is incorrect or if you would like to add the dimensions and production numbers, please post info

 

The OTHER notes section!!!

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete M

Curb weight for the 2wd short bed was 2912

4wd sb was 3076

2wd lb was 2959

4wd lb was 3141

 

Payload for stock MJs is 1475 lbs (1200 for 86), Metric Tonne was 2205 lbs. The maximum tow rating an MJ was ever given was 5000 lbs (4.0L required). 2.5Ls seem to have been limited to 2000 lbs and 2.8Ls were 4200. I cannot find any rating listed for the stock bumper. Every brochure mentions a class 1,2,3 hitch needs to be installed for towing.

 

 

Special thanks to: cj7xjmj, Pete M, krodeMJ, MJDriver, Drahcir495, Guumba, and 1986Comanche

__________________

[DirtyComanche]

I think it's wrong. But I haven't tried 2dr XJ flares yet as I don't have a 2dr. But, I just might play a bit the next time I'm in the junkyard (probably tomorrow).

[Eagle]

There are SO many things wrong in that long spec list that I wouldn't even know where to start. However -- I have owned my XJ since I bought it new in 1988, I've owned MJs for several years, the red '88 came with no rear flares and I want to put them on, so I can assure you that I thoroughly investigated using XJ flares. That's the reason why I have a pair of 2-door XJ quarter panels here.

 

They do not fit the MJ. To make them work I would need to hammer the sides of the MJ wheel arches perfectly flush, then graft the XJ sheet metal over the MJ panel, resulting in a smaller wheel arch opening. It can be done, and it might be what I end up doing ... but it's not my first choice.

[feerocknok]

Sorry to bring back an old post, but I keep thinking about redefining the truck.

 

So we decided that no XJ flares would fit the rear, unless serious bodywork was done?

[Eagle]

So we decided that no XJ flares would fit the rear, unless serious bodywork was done?

I don't know if the overall thread ever reached a consensus, since I know for a fact that XJ flares won't fit and at least two other posters insisted they will.

 

Do whatever you think is best for you.

[feerocknok]

I'll tear apart a couple XJs in the yard next time I go, 2dr and 4dr and take pics for everyone next to the Manche they have.

 

It will be a destructive rampage to gain information and expand the knowledge of MJ owners throughout the forum.

[feerocknok]

MMMMkayyyyy.

 

I did it.

 

I went to the Junkyard.

 

I then removed a rear flare from a 2 door XJ, a 4 door XJ, and pulled the flare off the MJ.

 

First off, as far as my eye could see, the 2 and 4 door XJ flares are the same. Argue if you want, but the 2 I pulled are the same.

 

Second off, you can use the XJ flares, but it's hideous as $#!&.

 

Here ya are!

 

And an XJ flare put up on the MJ. Hard to take a picture, hold the flare, and show fitment, but this is lined up with the body line, and centered in the well, and you can see the dirt from the MJ flare.

There's a rib around where the MJ flare mounts that makes it so the XJ flare won't sit flush at all.

 

Thought I'd give an update... 2 months later.

[Eagle]

Thank you, feerocknok, for documenting what I've been saying all along. What you didn't mention but the last photo shows is that the XJ flare simply doesn't line up with the mounting flange on the MJ, so even if you wanted to use it and accept the poor fit -- you could not use the stock mounting plates, you would have to Mickey Mouse some way of putting them on.

 

Good "investigative journalism."

[jeepnut_99]

First of all, I'd like to thank feerocknok for going the extra step to clear things up! I just thought I'd add this. Bushwhacker makes some pretty nice looking flares for the MJ http://www.bushwacker.com/fender.asp?ma ... rch=Search They list the same part number as the 2 door XJ. Maybe this is where some of the confusion has come from. But you have to keep in mind, These are "cut-out" flares. You have to cut out a pretty good chunk of fender to get these to work. And as illustrated in the photos from feerocknok, the stock ones are definately different from the XJ.....Scott

[JeepcoMJ]

wow.

 

lots of bad info in this post.

 

 

2 Door XJ flares are the same as MJ flares.

 

4 door XJ flares have a slightly smaller rear flare to fit around the rear door. The will not work by bolting up directly.

 

However if you chop up anything will work

 

wrong. try again...2 door xj flares are NOT the same as mj rear flares.

[Crash_AF]

To help sort out the confusion, here is a list of corrections from what I have been able to determine over the years. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

The taillight lenses are different from a Cherokee's, the wheel flares are the same (as a 2dr Cherokee), hoods are swappable from 84-92 models Cherokee's (Cherokee's above 92 used spring-loaded hinges), and all mechanical/electronic parts forward of the firewall ARE identical.

 

MJ's are the same from the firewall forward as the same year XJ. Hoods have different latches 84-86 and 87+.

 

AW4 - 4 speed automatic, electronically controlled - manufactured by Aisin - used from 87-92 (87-92 models include a Power/Comfort button that adjusts the shift points, also known as a towing package; all transmissions came with the towing package and came with a transmission cooler; 88+ models used Power/Comfort switch for off-roading)

 

The AW4 is the same as the Cherokee's. Power/Comfort switch is on all AW4s in the MJ vintage. Text is confusing, but all towing package or off road package MJ's have an additional transmission cooler.

 

Dana 30 high pinion - reverse cut - 27 spline, 1.16" diameter shafts, 7.13" ring gear - used 86-92 (all axles are vacuum disconnect, and have 5-260x u-joints)

 

Command-Trac front axles are vacuum disconnect, Selec-Trac are not. 91-92 are all non-disco.

 

Later,

Joe

[92mj01xj]

Hmm My 92 mj has 01 xj flares on it

 

[92mj01xj]

as a matter of fact I am going to the yard today to grab some new ones guy across the street backed into mine and cracked it. grrr. 1992 Mj to many things to list. lets just say its clean. and it takes a lot of balls to cut a hole in your roof just to have the sun on your face... getting ready to 4x4 convert it. already converted my 01.

[dunnc1991]

Holy old thread