Gubachoo Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 Hey guys, I had always hoped that I would find a thread like this when I was researching my lift and didn't (no need to throw links at me now because I'm bad at searching, just telling the story) so I figured I would make my own. Honestly not sure if this belongs here or in the build thread, but since its just a repair/upgrade over a weekend I figured here made sense, it will be moved I'm sure if I am wrong. So my jeep, like most of ours, had most of the original suspension components on it and my tires were almost gone so I did my research and finally decided on Hellcreek for my suspension. I am a tall guy and the bed height always annoyed me as did feeling like I was getting into a car more than getting into a truck when I opened the door and headed for the seat. My truck had the 215's stock and I put 235's I had on it when I bought it in 2011. I Now, something that I did not know and many of you guys may not (that I would have liked to know beforehand) is that Tom at Hellcreek basically just deals in the rear springs and contracts out all other components such as front coils and shocks etc. I called Tom and had a great conversation with him and (after annoying him with my indecision at finding these facts out) ordered a set of 4.5 lift rear springs. These are not cheap at about 650 shipped, but as anyone reading this knows, we don't have a ton of choices and I had heard good things about Tom and liked him a lot in our conversation and he had been very helpful and patient in answering my questions. I had not heard great things about the company he used to contract the front kit (will remain unnamed but it's spoken about here a lot) especially when I found out what shocks they used and found out I could not order a kit without shocks. I knew I wanted to do everything in one shot in one weekend and go with the best components I could afford and I had set aside some money to do this whole thing. I had decided to go with Rubicon express for the rest of the components so I ordered their full Cherokee kit (the AAL spring steel being a bonus as I like to do a little amateur blacksmithing) with the Monotube Shocks. I called them and found out they use Tenneco (Monroe) shocks which I have always liked a lot. Plus the adjustable upper control arms, tubular lowers, and adjustable track bar. Extended braided brake hoses and (from Tom @HC) the adjustable control rod for the rear brakes. So all this in hand, and a colder weekend than I planned on, I started on saturday morning on the floor of the garage. Now when I had done this, and reinstalled the rear axle I noticed that it was located differently than it was before (being stationed an inch or two fore of where it was with the old springs) and after double checking I had done everything right I came here and asked the opinion of the community and also emailed Tom @HC to ask him. While waiting for him to respond a few people and I hashed out reasons why this could be and what it could affect. Tom eventually emailed me back to say he designed it that way so as to not need a longer driveshaft and the wheel would move up and back when compressed and stay in the wheelwell as designed. This seemed to make sense to me and others, but just so you understand what I am saying when you see the photos. You can read up on it here if you wanna see the discussion and Toms responses. Because I'm kinda a nerd about stuff like this, I took measurements in a bunch of spots before and after lift and before and after the new tires. So there are three sets of measure here. The driveway wasn't perfectly level so the measurements are a little wonky (plus lord knows my truck isn't exactly perfect) but should give you the general idea. I used 31x10.50x15 Wrangler Duratrac tires (my third set and I recommend them highly) and they actually never rub no matter what I have done so far whereas the 235's would rub at full lock on the stock suspension. I was very impressed with the quality of the RI stuff, very well built and accurate, down to the coatings. Joints all moved freely, instructions were clear and comprehensive, parts were well labeled and organized, and fit and finish was great. I was super pleased with how much tighter the front end felt after doing this as well. I went from 30-35 degrees of slop in the steering wheel to maybe 10 and a much more responsive steering system. Obviously the ride was greatly improved being that the shocks were almost a decade old and the springs were all original save the left rear. It is a truck like ride, a little stiff but solid and good road feeling. I actually expected these shocks to be harsher than they are, but am happy they are not. We will see how they change as they settle in. Also while doing this I figured I would crack open my front axle disconnect to find out why my 4wd had recently quit and hopefully replace the lost snapring or whatever (had previously machined a groove in the shaft holding the fork to keep it in the locked position) and found the fork had broken! So as a side note, anyone got a junk D30 they would sell me the fork out of cheap? Pretty please? It just started snowing a lot here in northern VT... in the mean time, thank god for good tires... So I don't know how to/if it's possible to post photos at intervals so I'll just throw them all in here in an order that hopefully makes sense with the photos following the corresponding diagrams. The diagrams show my measurements at the corners at the lower points of the bumpers, at the bottom lip of the top of the wheelwells, and the axle tubes (which obviously didn't change until the tires did, but it would have annoyed me to not put that measurement in there... haha) and like I said, not perfectly level truck or driveway and it's rounded to the closest 1/2". The first set is Pre lift. Please ignore my New England speed holes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubachoo Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 More Pre-lift Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubachoo Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 Now for the spring side by side comparison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubachoo Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 And here is post lift pre tires Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubachoo Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubachoo Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 Looks Goofy all jacked up with those tiny tires... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubachoo Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 And lastly with the New 31's on board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubachoo Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubachoo Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubachoo Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 And that's that. Hope it helps people out. Shout out any questions if you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ωhm Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 Lift w/tires looks good. Flip your grill, its upside down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jargon Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 4 hours ago, Gubachoo said: Please ignore my New England speed holes. Does that mean holes from rust? If so, I will not mention the rust . Otherwise, lift looks nice. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WyoCherokee Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 looks good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete M Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 I would drill a new hole in the perch to move the tire back a bit. no matter what reason they give, that just looks wrong. plenty of guys are running stock shafts on a 4.5" lift without that wonkyness. you don't need a fork at all to fix the CAD. just use a hose clamp to keep the collar in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOrnbrod Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 32 minutes ago, Pete M said: I would drill a new hole in the perch to move the tire back a bit. no matter what reason they give, that just looks wrong. plenty of guys are running stock shafts on a 4.5" lift without that wonkyness. Agree, but I think I'd beef up the perches a bit first. Doesn't look like there's a whole lot of meat left on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubachoo Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 7 hours ago, Pete M said: I would drill a new hole in the perch to move the tire back a bit. no matter what reason they give, that just looks wrong. plenty of guys are running stock shafts on a 4.5" lift without that wonkyness. you don't need a fork at all to fix the CAD. just use a hose clamp to keep the collar in place. Hmm... I had thought about that but I'm not a big fan of fixes like that. Hose clamps around axle shafts are pretty hinky repairs, no offense meant, just not my style. I think in the spring I will remove the axle and machine a groove for a snapring to hold it in place. For now I would like to get the fork just to get me through the winter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubachoo Posted December 15, 2017 Author Share Posted December 15, 2017 7 hours ago, HOrnbrod said: Agree, but I think I'd beef up the perches a bit first. Doesn't look like there's a whole lot of meat left on them. 7 hours ago, Pete M said: I would drill a new hole in the perch to move the tire back a bit. no matter what reason they give, that just looks wrong. plenty of guys are running stock shafts on a 4.5" lift without that wonkyness. you don't need a fork at all to fix the CAD. just use a hose clamp to keep the collar in place. Damn. I was hoping to not do something like that. It will have to wait until the spring. I agree that I don't like it, I just wish I could find others who have HC springs and see if this is normal for them, or if smoke is being blown up my skirt. While the location looks odd, I have put probably 1000 miles on it since then with 0 issues. The perches are actually in good condition. The rust on this is almost totally on the body (the heavy stuff at least) as everything else had a healthy undercoat that was clearly touched up once in a while by the original owner (military man who owned it and took good care of it for its first 285,000) so the drilling of the perches is doable, I just find myself resistant to that because it then means I spent 650 on incorrect springs which sure makes me red in the face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubachoo Posted December 15, 2017 Author Share Posted December 15, 2017 16 hours ago, Jargon said: Does that mean holes from rust? If so, I will not mention the rust . Otherwise, lift looks nice. Thanks. Haha, thats them. Make me go faster and look cooler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Dan Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 Do you plan on addressing it, at some point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete M Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 didn't another member go through the axle-pushed-forward problem just a couple weeks ago? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOrnbrod Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 I think he was SUA w. MT springs though? Maybe wrong.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeep Driver Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 36 minutes ago, Pete M said: didn't another member go through the axle-pushed-forward problem just a couple weeks ago? Yes, same spring, same company, same unacceptable problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubachoo Posted December 15, 2017 Author Share Posted December 15, 2017 20 hours ago, Pete M said: didn't another member go through the axle-pushed-forward problem just a couple weeks ago? I didn't see another pop up, that may have just been my thread you saw? 20 hours ago, Big Dan said: Do you plan on addressing it, at some point? You know, I'm still undecided. There is no issue, save the aesthetics, and I'm not super big on those, so I'm really not sure. I could do it, but in the name of function, I can't see why I would need to. It wouldn't be that big of a deal to do, I need to put in up in the air, spend some time contemplating, and decide if it's worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Dan Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 Well, is this a vehicle you plan on keeping? Even if you're not, theres only so many left. I just would hate to see it rot completely away, eventually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minuit Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 Jeep Comanche Superleggera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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