redwolf624 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 ok so i'm a little confused and could use some help with this, i know for the nylon strap it'd be good to have 2" or bigger but what bought chains and shackles, i'm thinkin 1 1/2" chain and a 1" shackle, tryin to put together my own recovery system, but it's kinda hard since i've never been stuck and don't know what sizes to get stuff in, i know me personally want chains and shackles and tow hooks but i just don't know what a good size would be for it, also didn't know where to put this, sounded like a tech question to me :) Redwolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpace6a Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Just saying, the search feature is a wonderful thing. Secondly, do NOT use chains. Chains are fine for constant pressure, but when you get stuck, theres almost always tugging, jerking, etc, and chains can/will break, and can/will kill you and bystanders. Theres many members on this and other forums who wouldnt even consider going wheeling anywhere with you if chains are your recovery choice. Second, for tow hooks, you need brackets. don't just bolt them into the unibody because they will tear out and go flying at high speeds, like chains. Use straps with a breaking point twice the weight of your jeep with closed loops, no hooks. Simple as that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwolf624 Posted September 3, 2013 Author Share Posted September 3, 2013 Just saying, the search feature is a wonderful thing. Secondly, do NOT use chains. Chains are fine for constant pressure, but when you get stuck, theres almost always tugging, jerking, etc, and chains can/will break, and can/will kill you and bystanders. Theres many members on this and other forums who wouldnt even consider going wheeling anywhere with you if chains are your recovery choice. Second, for tow hooks, you need brackets. don't just bolt them into the unibody because they will tear out and go flying at high speeds, like chains. Use straps with a breaking point twice the weight of your jeep with closed loops, no hooks. Simple as that. so say i was to get stuck alone and i had a hi lift jack, would chains be better for that issue but if i'm gettin pulled out my someone else i need tow straps like this one? also i was lookin at shackles like this one would that not work? Redwolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GirsMJ86 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 http://comancheclub.com/topic/14360-suggested-towingrecovery-rules-of-the-forum/ http://www.rustysoffroad.com/vehicle-recovery-equipment/jeep-hitches-winch-mounts-tow-hooks/rustys-tow-hook-kit-xj.html http://www.rustysoffroad.com/vehicle-recovery-equipment/tow-straps-shackles-fairleads-more/recovery-shackles-d-rings/rustys-bolt-on-shackle.html Going to need the tow hook brackets and the bolt-on shackles are a must IMO since straps slip off hooks. Of course this is assuming you have factory bumpers, if you have off road ones then you hopefully opted to have shackle mounts added on. Since my chrome bumpers are not in the best of shape, I plan on getting JCR bumpers and will be having the shackle mounts and receivers both front and rear so I can move a winch to where I need it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MancheKid86 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 those straps are what you want, and bigger clevis's than the one displayed deff need recovery points braced into brackets i used 3 30 foot straps hooked together to get me out the other night most of all, you need a big deisel recovery truck on stand by, my come along didnt do anything when i was stuck in the mud Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW86 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 bubba rope or one in the like as far as mud goes. if theres enough room to get a running start youll be out of there in no time! i have a smitty 30ft strap cause it was cheaper. it does the job. i also have a 30ft chain,,, that never gets used. of course theres always just buying a winch and be done with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwolf624 Posted September 3, 2013 Author Share Posted September 3, 2013 http://comancheclub.com/topic/14360-suggested-towingrecovery-rules-of-the-forum/ http://www.rustysoffroad.com/vehicle-recovery-equipment/jeep-hitches-winch-mounts-tow-hooks/rustys-tow-hook-kit-xj.html http://www.rustysoffroad.com/vehicle-recovery-equipment/tow-straps-shackles-fairleads-more/recovery-shackles-d-rings/rustys-bolt-on-shackle.html Going to need the tow hook brackets and the bolt-on shackles are a must IMO since straps slip off hooks. Of course this is assuming you have factory bumpers, if you have off road ones then you hopefully opted to have shackle mounts added on. Since my chrome bumpers are not in the best of shape, I plan on getting JCR bumpers and will be having the shackle mounts and receivers both front and rear so I can move a winch to where I need it. thanks for the links, i completely missed the CC link, i do have the factory stock bumper, everything on my truck is factory, i don't have a 4wheel drive rig, but that doesn't stop me from tearin a field up :D the rustys likes, do those bolt onto where the trailer hitch would go? also if i was to get a trailer hitch couldn't i modify it to have shackles? those straps are what you want, and bigger clevis's than the one displayed deff need recovery points braced into brackets i used 3 30 foot straps hooked together to get me out the other night most of all, you need a big deisel recovery truck on stand by, my come along didnt do anything when i was stuck in the mud recorvery points would be the rustys link posted above right? also what do ya mean by a bigger clevis, a bigger loop? i know the come along problem, my dad had one and it sunk is wrangler into the mud more and snaped the cable on it bubba rope or one in the like as far as mud goes. if theres enough room to get a running start youll be out of there in no time! i have a smitty 30ft strap cause it was cheaper. it does the job. i also have a 30ft chain,,, that never gets used. of course theres always just buying a winch and be done with it what's a bubba rope? also i think i'll get the straps but i'm also still lookin at the chains as an emergency thing, i looked at em at first cause they will not would water, i could dry em off and they'd be good, winch i will not do, they're great and all but i always can see that cable snappin in my face and killin me, Redwolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MancheKid86 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Bigger loop yes, if your gettin snapped out you gonna trust a 1 1/2 ring? Also on the winch topic, there s rope for winches, also most winches now a days have an in cab controller, the onlt way it will snap is if its not maintained and tensile strength rating is not what it should be, they are waaaaaay safer than chains Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwolf624 Posted September 3, 2013 Author Share Posted September 3, 2013 Bigger loop yes, if your gettin snapped out you gonna trust a 1 1/2 ring? Also on the winch topic, there s rope for winches, also most winches now a days have an in cab controller, the onlt way it will snap is if its not maintained and tensile strength rating is not what it should be, they are waaaaaay safer than chains depends on how thick the shackle is and what the tensile strength is, i still like the idea of straps and chains, but like i said, i don't have a 4wheel drive rig, i don't go off road that much unless i want to lay the grass in the field behide my house :rotf: but i do not know anywhere to put recovery points, i understand how a helicopter flys more than the whole recovery anchor points, i know the tention is greater on chains than it is on nylon and the snap method that is safer on nylon rather than on chains where the tacks can/will break, Redwolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H3RESQ Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Just in case you didn't catch all the other posts......NO CHAINS!!!!! Use straps!!, and shackles. NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockfrog Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 The shackle he picture is a 1 1/2" shackle ... which means the PIN is 1 1/2" diameter ... it is rated to 17T working load so 34,000lbs. Shackles are industry rated with a 5x safety factor ... (so the shackle in question should have an 85T failure strength). I have been using 3/4" shackles for years ... that's 3/4" pin shackles. I would however suggest buying a shackle made in the USA or Canada ... avoid the China stamped shackle as they are not held to industry standards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GirsMJ86 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 The Rusty's kit is basically an exact copy of the factory XJ/MJ tow hook brackets that go up front. They bolt to holes that are already there on the frame, the same ones the bumper brackets bolt to and one further back. The shackle add-ons then bolt onto those rather than using the hooks. For the rear, an off road bumper or hitch is your best bet. If I wasn't grabbing an off road rear bumper I would have some brackets similar to those front ones made that bolt onto where the rear bumper does then taking it a step further if you wanted a hitch (since rear hitches are getting hard to come by), you could have a shop make one and the brackets of it could be made similar to those front brackets so you would have some place to bolt up hooks or shackles. Hope that makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwolf624 Posted September 3, 2013 Author Share Posted September 3, 2013 Just in case you didn't catch all the other posts......NO CHAINS!!!!! Use straps!!, and shackles. NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS NO CHAINS got that :thumbsup: but i'm still lookin at a set or two of chains as an emergency backup just incase that strap snaps, rule number one, always have a backup plan :yes: The shackle he picture is a 1 1/2" shackle ... which means the PIN is 1 1/2" diameter ... it is rated to 17T working load so 34,000lbs. Shackles are industry rated with a 5x safety factor ... (so the shackle in question should have an 85T failure strength). I have been using 3/4" shackles for years ... that's 3/4" pin shackles. I would however suggest buying a shackle made in the USA or Canada ... avoid the China stamped shackle as they are not held to industry standards trust me, i don't even trust my fuel pump, it's made in china, same with my radiator, i ALWAYS try to get north american made equipment :D The Rusty's kit is basically an exact copy of the factory XJ/MJ tow hook brackets that go up front. They bolt to holes that are already there on the frame, the same ones the bumper brackets bolt to and one further back. The shackle add-ons then bolt onto those rather than using the hooks. For the rear, an off road bumper or hitch is your best bet. If I wasn't grabbing an off road rear bumper I would have some brackets similar to those front ones made that bolt onto where the rear bumper does then taking it a step further if you wanted a hitch (since rear hitches are getting hard to come by), you could have a shop make one and the brackets of it could be made similar to those front brackets so you would have some place to bolt up hooks or shackles. Hope that makes sense. now i'm confused, pictures would help me understand a lot better with the hock and shackle add ons, also how would i do the shackle thing on the hitch? Redwolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete M Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 the backup plan should be strap #2. :thumbsup: if you broke a 30k lb strap, what good is that chain? having said that, I have a big ol' chain in the truck. but it's there for other reasons (like towing a broken truck back to camp). the strap is used only for recovery to keep it as pristene as possible. keep that strap clean (wash it out after use) and away from sunlight and heat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwolf624 Posted September 3, 2013 Author Share Posted September 3, 2013 the backup plan should be strap #2. :thumbsup: if you broke a 30k lb strap, what good is that chain? having said that, I have a big ol' chain in the truck. but it's there for other reasons (like towing a broken truck back to camp). the strap is used only for recovery to keep it as pristene as possible. keep that strap clean (wash it out after use) and away from sunlight and heat. that is true pete, but say chain is stronger than strap :dunno: i'd use the chain for towin as well Redwolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockfrog Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 now i'm confused, pictures would help me understand a lot better with the hock and shackle add ons, also how would i do the shackle thing on the hitch? Redwolf with one of these - Same one I use ... FYI that's a 3/4" shackle it is supplied with ;) :thumbsup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete M Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 the backup plan should be strap #2. :thumbsup: if you broke a 30k lb strap, what good is that chain? having said that, I have a big ol' chain in the truck. but it's there for other reasons (like towing a broken truck back to camp). the strap is used only for recovery to keep it as pristine as possible. keep that strap clean (wash it out after use) and away from sunlight and heat. that is true pete, but say chain is stronger than strap :dunno: i'd use the chain for towin as well Redwolf that's some dang heavy and expensive chain to compete with a 30k lb strap ($40 for 30 feet and it only weighs a few pounds). Chain's big benefit is abrasion resistance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwolf624 Posted September 4, 2013 Author Share Posted September 4, 2013 now i'm confused, pictures would help me understand a lot better with the hock and shackle add ons, also how would i do the shackle thing on the hitch? Redwolf with one of these - Same one I use ... FYI that's a 3/4" shackle it is supplied with ;) :thumbsup: i've been lookin at those, they're sweet but i'm mainly just lookin for the shackle part bein that i don't have a hitch :( the backup plan should be strap #2. :thumbsup: if you broke a 30k lb strap, what good is that chain? having said that, I have a big ol' chain in the truck. but it's there for other reasons (like towing a broken truck back to camp). the strap is used only for recovery to keep it as pristine as possible. keep that strap clean (wash it out after use) and away from sunlight and heat. that is true pete, but say chain is stronger than strap :dunno: i'd use the chain for towin as well Redwolf that's some dang heavy and expensive chain to compete with a 30k lb strap ($40 for 30 feet and it only weighs a few pounds). Chain's big benefit is abrasion resistance. agreed but anything is possible in this world now a days, Redwolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockfrog Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 :doh: then why even ask about how to attach a shackle to a receiver? i've been lookin at those, they're sweet but i'm mainly just lookin for the shackle part bein that i don't have a hitch :( now i'm confused, pictures would help me understand a lot better with the hock and shackle add ons, also how would i do the shackle thing on the hitch? Redwolf Redwolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwolf624 Posted September 4, 2013 Author Share Posted September 4, 2013 :doh: then why even ask about how to attach a shackle to a receiver? i've been lookin at those, they're sweet but i'm mainly just lookin for the shackle part bein that i don't have a hitch :( now i'm confused, pictures would help me understand a lot better with the hock and shackle add ons, also how would i do the shackle thing on the hitch? Redwolf Redwolf i was askin about the rusty's shackle brackets in the links above, Redwolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GirsMJ86 Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 What I was saying about adding the brackets to a hitch that you could bolt hooks or bolt-on shackles to would be as simple as adding onto the side of the receiver brackets the "L" that holds the hooks on those Rusty's front tow hook brackets. Would allow you to have two hooks/shackles in the rear and an empty receiver at the same time for something else rather than using one of those shackle receiver adapters. As an example: 1985 Chevy K-10 rear receiver: How you could modify it to add hook mounting points similar to what Rusty's did with the front brackets (red is what is added): Would be even easier if the hitch was custom made so it would be an actual extension of the receiver bracket just bent over and up then welded along the back that comes flush with the side of the bracket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwolf624 Posted September 4, 2013 Author Share Posted September 4, 2013 What I was saying about adding the brackets to a hitch that you could bolt hooks or bolt-on shackles to would be as simple as adding onto the side of the receiver brackets the "L" that holds the hooks on those Rusty's front tow hook brackets. Would allow you to have two hooks/shackles in the rear and an empty receiver at the same time for something else rather than using one of those shackle receiver adapters. As an example: 1985 Chevy K-10 rear receiver: How you could modify it to add hook mounting points similar to what Rusty's did with the front brackets (red is what is added): Would be even easier if the hitch was custom made so it would be an actual extension of the receiver bracket just bent over and up then welded along the back that comes flush with the side of the bracket. ok i got it now, if i ever build my own hitch do to the lack of knowin what i could pull a hitch off of to slap onto my MJ other than another MJ i'll be doin that; i currently have the stock rear bumper with what looks like a catch for the hook and eye latch from lowes that a lot of people put on cabinets, Redwolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 the backup plan should be strap #2. :thumbsup: if you broke a 30k lb strap, what good is that chain? having said that, I have a big ol' chain in the truck. but it's there for other reasons (like towing a broken truck back to camp). the strap is used only for recovery to keep it as pristene as possible. keep that strap clean (wash it out after use) and away from sunlight and heat. Another vote for a second strap. Keep in mind that there is a difference between "recovery" and "towing." Recovery often (usually) involves applying hard, jerking forces -- the rescue vehicle takes a running start, which applies a dynamic force to the recovery gear when the slack is taken up. That's why we use only nylon straps -- they are slightly elastic, so they stretch just a bit under that dynamic load. Then they want to recover the amount they stretched, and that helps to yank the stuck vehicle forward. For the same reason, we DON'T prefer to use recovery straps for towing. You DON'T want a tow line to stretch. Chain is good for towing because it doesn't stretch. Chain is also a LOT heavier than a 2" or even 3" strap, and takes up a lot more space. Add a shackle to a receiver hitch? Simple: http://www.discountjeepparts.com/product_info.php/products_id/433 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwolf624 Posted September 4, 2013 Author Share Posted September 4, 2013 the backup plan should be strap #2. :thumbsup: if you broke a 30k lb strap, what good is that chain? having said that, I have a big ol' chain in the truck. but it's there for other reasons (like towing a broken truck back to camp). the strap is used only for recovery to keep it as pristene as possible. keep that strap clean (wash it out after use) and away from sunlight and heat. Another vote for a second strap. Keep in mind that there is a difference between "recovery" and "towing." Recovery often (usually) involves applying hard, jerking forces -- the rescue vehicle takes a running start, which applies a dynamic force to the recovery gear when the slack is taken up. That's why we use only nylon straps -- they are slightly elastic, so they stretch just a bit under that dynamic load. Then they want to recover the amount they stretched, and that helps to yank the stuck vehicle forward. For the same reason, we DON'T prefer to use recovery straps for towing. You DON'T want a tow line to stretch. Chain is good for towing because it doesn't stretch. Chain is also a LOT heavier than a 2" or even 3" strap, and takes up a lot more space. Add a shackle to a receiver hitch? Simple: http://www.discountjeepparts.com/product_info.php/products_id/433 i agree with that eagle, i know the logic behide all that, the main reason i started lookin at chains in the first place is, like i said earlier, they're easier to wipe off and not hold water, and where i go "off roadin" it's a field behide my house, it's not that soft of dirt untill ya get to the ditch that i dug out for my yard drain out, i don't really have to have the person pullin me out get a runnin start, specially since the little cars don't get stock in there (even though they go on the sides of the field like wimps) i DO NOT have a 4wheel drive rig (sadly) so i won't do any extreme muddin or off roadin, although i'm thinkin bout makin my MJ a 4wheel drive rig one day, Redwolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrankTheDog Posted September 4, 2013 Share Posted September 4, 2013 You won't be able to get your rig buried enough to ever break a 30,000 lb strap. It'll tear your rig in two before it'll ever break. The weight of a chain will beat the crap out of whatever surface you put it on if you keep it in the truck. AND as said before they are extremely dangerous if you don't know how to properly use them. Using them for recovery is not using them properly. I saw a chain cleave a 79 Bronco top in half when it broke from yanking on it. It took out the windshield and rear window also. Needless to say the driver was quite shook up and upset that his 4 year old truck at the time was ruined. Luckily nobody was hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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