New Paint?

[philbert001]

philbert - I noticed that you didn't mention sanding between coats. Is the idea to get a perfect sanding during the prep work, then sand again after the paint has dried?

 

LEAD - That looks pretty good, what rattle can did you use?

My post was based on how professional painters do the job. If you do proper prep work, Sanding your base is not necessary. Sanding your base between coats is like using your base as primer. That's what primer is for! using your base as primer sounds like a waste of basecoat/money. sanding between coats is only necessary if you are a terrible painter, and are willing to wait like 4 hours between coats. I've painted 1/2 million dollar cars, and have never sanded my base between coats. The only thing I can think of even remotely related to that would be colorsanding your first clear job, and re-clearing to get that perfect glasslike finish. In which case, you probably aren't doing it yourself! The idea of a "Perfect sanding job" is to use progressively finer paper to cancel the previous sand scratches. As in, use 80 grit for your body work. use 120 grit to sand out the 80 grit scratches. use 180 grit to sand out the 120 scratches. Prime the job. sand with 220-240 grit paper. Sand with 320-360 to sand out the 220 scratches. sand with 400-800 (depending on basecoat) to sand out the 360 scratches. and you are ready for paint.

[bigalpha]

Gotcha. I have been reading how people will do the $50 paint job, and sand between coats to get rid of the orange peel effect. I thought it would be the same as if you used an air gun to paint with. Obviously I was wrong. :roll:

 

Given how much easier using an air gun sounds, I might be borrowing a compressor and buying a spray gun.

[philbert001]

Gotcha. I have been reading how people will do the $50 paint job, and sand between coats to get rid of the orange peel effect. I thought it would be the same as if you used an air gun to paint with. Obviously I was wrong. :roll:

 

Given how much easier using an air gun sounds, I might be borrowing a compressor and buying a spray gun.

Practice makes perfect. Every time you screw up, as long as you figure out why, you'll learn something, and get better! If you buy a spray gun, just make sure it's HVLP(high volume low pressure) They use less air, and lay out smoother coats. Everything else is junk and you won't be happy with it.

[jtdesigns]

Gotcha. I have been reading how people will do the $50 paint job, and sand between coats to get rid of the orange peel effect. I thought it would be the same as if you used an air gun to paint with. Obviously I was wrong. :roll:

 

Given how much easier using an air gun sounds, I might be borrowing a compressor and buying a spray gun.

Practice makes perfect. Every time you screw up, as long as you figure out why, you'll learn something, and get better! If you buy a spray gun, just make sure it's HVLP(high volume low pressure) They use less air, and lay out smoother coats. Everything else is junk and you won't be happy with it.

I have to disagree on the HVLP.. They use a high flow of air at low pressures.. BUT... I do agree that their the best for auto finishes.. less over spray, less waste, blah, blah, blah,, but you better have a compressor that'll keep up.. And alot of those guns need bigger airlines..

[philbert001]

Gotcha. I have been reading how people will do the $50 paint job, and sand between coats to get rid of the orange peel effect. I thought it would be the same as if you used an air gun to paint with. Obviously I was wrong. :roll:

 

Given how much easier using an air gun sounds, I might be borrowing a compressor and buying a spray gun.

Practice makes perfect. Every time you screw up, as long as you figure out why, you'll learn something, and get better! If you buy a spray gun, just make sure it's HVLP(high volume low pressure) They use less air, and lay out smoother coats. Everything else is junk and you won't be happy with it.

I have to disagree on the HVLP.. They use a high flow of air at low pressures.. BUT... I do agree that their the best for auto finishes.. less over spray, less waste, blah, blah, blah,, but you better have a compressor that'll keep up.. And alot of those guns need bigger airlines..

HVLP guns run about 25-35 psi at the air cap in an optimum world. conventional guns need closer to 50 psi at the cap, and still don't atomize the paint nearly as well. Before I got a bigger compessor, I was painting in my shop at home with a Devillebiss 30 gallon 5hp compressor. And I've never run larger airlines/fittings at home. Modern automotive finishes NEED to be sprayed through an hvlp gun. A conventional gun can't atomize the paint enough to lay out properly. You may be able to get away with it on certain colors, but I wouldn't recommend it. I'm just saying, when you go to harbor freight to buy a cheap gun, (Because I don't expect you to go buy a $600 SATA to paint in your garage!), Don't buy the $20 siphon gun with the 2.0mm fluid tip, Get the $50 hvlp gravity gun with the 1.3mm fluid tip. (The siphon gun would make a decent primer gun for ya' though.)

 

I guess I AM the "Paint Nazi", and my word is scripture dammit!

[Jonny878]

philbert001, not to keep beating the drum, but great advice. That last part in regard to the gun is very helpful (HVLP) also. I think I may have to give vehicle painting a try (always wanted to).

 

After reading everyone's experiences, that $200 Maaco paint job looks like its more hassle than its worth. I thought it might fade in a year or two, but a few months.... I will reconsider. The top of my truck is so faded nothing but new paint will bring it back. I was thinking for that price (Maaco's summer special) it will give the truck a little shine and get it one color, but maybe not.

[philbert001]

philbert001, not to keep beating the drum, but great advice. That last part in regard to the gun is very helpful (HVLP) also. I think I may have to give vehicle painting a try (always wanted to).

 

After reading everyone's experiences, that $200 Maaco paint job looks like its more hassle than its worth. I thought it might fade in a year or two, but a few months.... I will reconsider. The top of my truck is so faded nothing but new paint will bring it back. I was thinking for that price (Maaco's summer special) it will give the truck a little shine and get it one color, but maybe not.

Like I said, Do it yourself, and learn from the experience! You will be much prouder of a crappy paintjob you did yourself, than a crappy paintjob you paid money for!

[87ComancheLB]

I think you or anybody could do a lot better than Maaco. He paid them $994.14

Any painting tips? light tack coat, work from top down, overlap 50%, paint door jambs under hood first, etc?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgbFaez2MfM

[Eagle]

This might be good info for the DIY Write-Ups area, but ... does your computer have an "Enter" key? That's far to much text with no paragraph breaks. Makes my head hurt just lookin' at it. If I clone a copy over there, may I have your permission to do a clean-up edit?

 

I got a PM asking for tips on DIY paintjobs, and I ended up doing a full write up for him, so I'm gonna paste it here too, because some of you guys might find it helpful. I am a professional automotive painter, so this is advise from a pro, not from some hack garage painter. I hope this helps a few of you. PM me if you have any questions, or if I forgot anything.

These instructions are for solid colors. if you are doing a metallic, or pearl color, make sure to finish sand with 600-800 grit, so your sandscratches don't show through your basecoat.

 

Where to start! Ok, first off, it's all in the prep work. You want to make sure to thoroughly sand everything. I would say you need to finish sand, all your surfaces with no courser paper than 400 grit. And don't sand anything with anything courser than 220 grit, unless you are planning on priming it. You should prime anywhere that you cut through the factory finish.(Any where that you go through the clearcoat) You should sand your primer with 220-360, then with 400-600 along with the rest of your surfaces. Make sure to sand all your edges with a scotch brite pad, or some kind of abrasive pad, or your edges will start peeling in no time. Once you have everything prepped and masked, use a mild mineral spirit to clean and de-grease your surfaces. Wipe it on with one clean towel, and wipe it off till it's dry with another clean towel. Then use a tack cloth to pick up any remaining dust, and dirt off the surface. You can buy these at most Napa stores in the paint section for like 2 bucks each. I don't know where you are planning on painting, but don't do it outside. Any breeze is going to blow crap into your paint. Do it in your garage with the door cracked if possible. Do it on a nice 70-80 degree day. That's about the best temp range for your paint to cure best. OK, now it's time to spray! Be patient! You don't need to get complete coverage in 1 coat. Your best pet is to do a nice even "tack coat". That is just I nice light even coat. It'll look really splotchy, but that's fine. Tet that coat flash dry for 5-10 minutes before your next coat. That coat will give your next, heavier coat something to bite into. It will also help to keep from getting runs! Now, you don't have much air flow at 3.4 cfm, so keep your airflow low, and the feed on the gun fairly low. Use a piece of cardboard to get your gun set up good, not your truck! I don't know what you are using for paint guns, but get it setup so your fan is about 6-8 inches high where it hit's the panel, while keeping your gun about 6 inches away from the panel. like I said, light coats are key! After your first, "Tack coat", You want to spray your paint on just heavy enough to look "Wet". like I said, as long as it doesn't look dry, or like it is fuzzy, that's enough. Several light wet coats will turn out looking way better than if you try to hose it on in 1 coat. Give it 10-15 minutes between coats, until you have nice even coverage.(Till you can't see your primer spots anymore.) Make sure to do about 50% overlap on your coats. This means that if you have an 8 inch spray fan, move down 4 inches on each pass, so that each pass overlaps half of the last one. make sure to move across the panel at an even speed, keeping your gun as square as possible, and at an even distance from the panel. (The 6 inches away I talked about.) After you have good even color coverage, Put your last coat on just a little wetter. You can do this by slowing down the speed at which you move the gun across the panel, or you can open up the feed on the gun. (Just like 1/8-1/4 of a turn on the feed knob will be plenty.) If you are using single stage paint, you are done. If you are using basecoat/clearcoat, let your base dry for 20-30 minutes before you clear it. Spray your clear the same as your base, Only give it one tack coat, (You don't need to get full shine on your first coat.) Then give it two even heavier coats, making sure to get full smooth coverage with no dry spots. Make sure to give it 15 minutes between coats. Let it air dry at least over night, and you are done. Let me know if you want to learn how to wetsand and buff, to make it look like glass! I hope this helped, and didn't overwhelm, or confuse you. Let me know if you need help with anything else! Good luck and have fun! Remember, don't rush it!

[cromanyak]

All together my paint job cost me about $400. I got the urethane kit from this place http://www.smartshoppersinc.com/ Its not best paint in the world but for the price I'm happy with it. I also bought my gun from them. Its a FinishLine III. Its a good beginners gun and best of all its rebuildable. Those cheap guns you can get for 50 bucks or so aren't. That gun with a regulator and 3 different size tips was about $125.

 

[cluricaunne]

I have a body shop here in WA that is going to do the body work on my truck, and spray the entire thing with bedliner for $500... he owes me a favor or two, but his retail would prolly run about 850 or so, and he does quality work.

[philbert001]

I have a body shop here in WA that is going to do the body work on my truck, and spray the entire thing with bedliner for $500... he owes me a favor or two, but his retail would prolly run about 850 or so, and he does quality work.

Let us know how it turns out! I was thinking about doing the bottom half of my XJ (Trail rig), Like that!

[jeepdoggydogB]

There was a color in 1991 called black cherry pearl coat, that I have been wanting to see if it could even be purchased any longer. Philberts numbers are on the money from every professional (non chain) paint shop I have checked out. $6,000 plus the reflexxion hood is where I would love to get to, putting it in perspective with all the labor one could also buy and install a tricked out stroker like Don's (hornbrod). I think I got my dreams all squared away, but it's the money part that screws things up. :eek:

[philbert001]

Bump for somebody looking for paint help.

[Blue88Comanche]

:popcorn: Thanks

[Donkey]

anyone ever use the duplicolor paint shop system i heard you got to buff it to get a good finish but seems pretty easy to use. I'm planning on doing the candy apple green then laying on some matte clear to flatten it. Any thoughts or anyone have experience with it.

[philbert001]

It's garbage! It's not a catalyzed paint. Without being catalyzed, it doesn't have any durability. You can get a better cheap single stage paint just about anywhere that IS catalyzed! Cheaper too! And unless you really know what you are doing, you're gonna have to wet-sand and buff ANY Paint system to make it look good! I use matte clear a lot on motorcycles, but if you are garage painting your truck, I would just go get a quart of matting agent, and just add it to whatever paint you buy. It'll be easier for a rookie painter to do it that way. Using matte clear is tricky. It is very thick in the gun, so you have to open up your fluid feed to get it to atomize, but once it does, it likes to run if you let it get away from you! Adding matting agent to single stage is probably your best bet!