jpnjim

MJ axles are 60" WMS to WMS. There were plenty of 60" wide AMC M20's (with 2-piece shafts & 5 on 4.5" wheels): 71-74 Javelin 75-80 Pacer coil spring rear 'big body' cars: Ambassador Matador Rebel all used 60" wide AMC 20's. Small body AMC's (Gremlin,Hornet, etc) used the narrower 58" wide axle till the AMC Eagle needed to use deeper backspacing wheels with it's driven ft axle. Solution, put the big body 60" axle in the small body Eagle. When XJ's were designed, they pretty much took the Eagle (Wide AMC) axle, and slung it AS IS under the XJ. That's why XJ's, then MJs, YJ's, ZJ's, TJ's, etc all used 60" wide axles, because thats what the XJ version 1 (AMC Eagle) used. Measure it Mike, 60" wide 20s are out there in AMC cars. (I could take pictures of the ones I have tucked away ;) )

Measure the housing width, and/or the axleshafts, I'll tell you what the numbers from a 60" wide AMC car axle are, so you can compare them (or you could install the shafts, and measure the WMS to WMS.) What is the wheel bolt pattern on the axle shafts? AMC Automotive 20's If they are 5 on 4.5", with a big center nut (and the backing plates captured behind the bearings on the shafts), then it is an automotive AMC model 20. Automotive 20s should be either 60", or 58" WMS to WMS. The spring perches would be SUA, but in the wrong position for MJ's (correct location for an XJ, but SUA instead of SOA like XJ's). Both have value, the 58" one usually being more valuable, since it's rarer, and fits small body AMC's (Gremlin, Hornet, Concord, Spirit, etc) CJ M20's If it's 5 on 5.5", as above, with the big center nut, it's a CJ 20 (most common to find), either wide trac, or narrow trac. Either is way too narrow for us, and not worth much $$$. FSJ M20 6 lug, with no center nuts = FSJ, as good as the MJ-20, but wrong wheel pattern, and the widths aren't perfect for us (~57 for narrow track rear, ~62 for wide track rear <--- from memory anyway) worth more than CJ 20's, but less than the AMC/MJ versions (since the FSJ-20's are still pretty common, and in less demand).

:cheers:

I don't know that anyone has had luck doing this yet, but you *should* be able to avoid premium gas with a stroker if you have the right compression ration, AND good quench. The original AMC 4.6L stokers were built in Mexico (by VAM), in the 70's & 80's specifically to produce more power from the 6 with low octane & high altitudes, so it can be done. I hate to quote Wiki :doh: but: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vehiculos_ ... _Mexicanos These were the original AMC strokers, 20 years before anyone ever put a 258 crank in a 4.0L block (even 16 years before AMC built a true 4.0L block) The biggest difference is off the shelf available pistons have horrible quench, with just slightly too much compression ratio. (VAM used 8-8.5:1 compression to deal with poor quality Mexican fuel). I haven't searched for a proper stroker piston in a long time, but the problem with off the shelf aftermarket pistons was they typically cut the compression distance down from the original spec, ten using it in a 'poor mans stroker' (with shorter 258 rods) ended up with the piston so far down in the hole that poor quench would kill combustion mixture quality, and give detonation, even with moderate compression ratio's. Using premium gas is a bandaid for the real problem of poor quench. I know some new stroker pistons have been developed over the last few years, might be worth looking into.

Did you get the axleshafts with it too? (don't look like they are there in the pics) If they are already out, and you get a chance, could you post up the axle shaft lengths please? I'm curious if their lengths are the same as the 60" wide (wide body) Model 20 used in AMC cars. When I get a chance I will post up the lengths of the 60" wide automotive M20s shafts for comparison. Glad to see you got it.

Guess I'm just lucky. :D I got mine out of a pair of YJ axles that fell on my doorstep (literally) A friend of a friend, some random Jeep guy knocked on my door one night & asked if I wanted a pair of Wrangler axles. I didn't want the C-clip 35, but they were newish 4cyl axles (4.10's), I'm thinking the set cost me $150, in 1998, when they were just 3 years old. :thumbsup: Got the carrier to do the 4.56 swap in my MJ, 297 disco shafts, later model knuckles & low mileage set of bearings/rotors (also eventually went on the MJ) and a spare set of HP4.10 gears. The craptactular 4.10 C-clip D35 went into my daily driver LWB MJ, and was a good excuse to weld on some perches & do a SOA.... even though it was still 2wd. Sometimes it's better to be lucky than good (thou I haven't seen good luck like that in a while :doh: ).

Yes, and 1995 was a 'long' year (since TJ's didn't come out till 96.5, as 97's), so they shouldn't be that hard to find.

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Yes. Back in 1998 or so, when they passed the emissions test legislation they exempted all vehicles over 25 years old (i.e.1973 and earlier). It was originally a rolling exemption, recalculated every two years. So 1975 and older got a Get Out of Jail Free Card as well. Then, as bureaucrats do, they realized they were leaving too much money on the table, so they terminated the rolling exemption portion of the law. So 1975 and earlier is the limit. Massachusetts (little commifornoia) used to have a 15 year rolling exemption, so 84's were deemed exempt in 1999. Then in Oct 1999 they changed systems (went to treadmills), and started emission testing even year vehicles on even years, and odd year vehicles on odd years. When 2000 rolled around, they un-exempted all the 84's, saying 'oh, 1984's were just exempt in 1999, because they are even year vehicles :roll: . Luckily (for now atleast), there is a happy ending to this story, in October 2009 the lease ran out on the equipment, software & service provided for the treadmill system, and Mass decided to abandon the program. :banana: Now, all that is done here is a plug in OBD II system check. If you have a 95', or older, non OBDII vehicle, you get by with a visual and safety check. :thumbsup: :thumbsup: Most vehicles in Mass start to turn to dust by 15-20 years old here anyway, so they seem to be willing to overlook us for now. The way California's budget is headed, maybe someday they will also abandon older vehicle testing as a cost saving measure. :dunno:

It would be interesting to see what their high arch design would look like on an XJ/MJ fender:

I've had a few BA's that would puke oil out of the vent tube, at highway speeds, when filled up to the fill plug (btw, you'll have to make, or buy the 4 sided socket to remove these plugs). I extended the vent hose up to the firewall, and never had the puking problem again. Keeping fresh gear oil in my old BA was probably the only thing that kept it alive. YMMV, but for me, the fastest way to change the fluid was: park over drip pan, on flat level driveway pull the bottom plug, as it drains, pull the upper plug (fill plug). Replace the lower plug, pull the shifter (put it in neutral, and pull the 3 retainer screws, I think they were 10mm). Pour new gear oil into shifter opening, stop as it starts to come out of fill hole. I guess you could get some kind of pressurized oil fill plunger-thing, and use the fill hole as intended, but I would end up laying flat on my back, trying to squeeze gear oil out of 1 qt containers, getting 1/2 of it on my crossmember, driveway, face, running down my arm, under my shirt, etc. :doh: Pulling the shifter was much better for me. :thumbsup:

It would be nice to have more options out there, and MetalCloak makes some very nice stuff, but you could probably buy a tubing bender, take a bending class, make the fenders yourself, and still pay less than the $$$$$ for MC's.

I made one out of a SOA Longbed: Never got around to triangulating the hitch, and never ended up using it for anything. :( (beyond yard storage) If you build one, hopefully you'll get more use out of yours than I did.

I tried to pop the gas gauge needle off my column shift gauge set, did not work out so well. :(

Here's a good page on 8.8's: http://www.therangerstation.com/tech_library/Axles.html 4.10 geared 8.8's are really common in junkyard Explorers, I bet an online junkyard search would find one close by. Then, if you have not already, consider becoming a member of a local 4wd club. That's almost a sure fire way to find new 'friends with welders' who don't mind burning some perches on for you in exchange for beer. :cheers: Once that's done, all you need is a 4.10 geared D30 (either have your gear guy swap gears in your, or better yet, use the junkyard search to find a complete 4.10 D30 out of a 4cyl XJ). Done. :thumbsup:

Probably just deleted the info they had. :( I hope not, but it's sounding like what they did to the stock pile of old NOS Jeep sheetmetal (scrapped :( )

From another thread: ( viewtopic.php?f=3&t=28570&start=15 ) This one is old enough, has the 327 61k miles, & a column shift. If it had barn doors on it, I'd have to find room for it somewhere: http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/ctd/2226598900.html 1967 Jeep Cherokee grand wagoneer - 61617 miles, tan - $4995 (Hopedale) sweet ride

Looks like I found the great great grandpa to the granpa-campa. Sears & Wards started selling Ben Hur trailers in the 1940's. (Ben Hur Manufacturing had made WWII military trailers) Then at some point Sears/David Bradley started offering a "Jiffy Camper' to go inside them: Image Not Found All pics from this thread (camper on page 10): http://www.earlycj5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74865 Makes me want to dig the granpa-campa out of the snowpile it's in, to start working on it again. :yes:

Grandpa Jeep in my sig is 1.5" to 2" lifted in front on factory TJ 30x9.5" tires/wheels: Lift is from sagged Rusty's coils that were originally 3" lift springs. Rear is stock 2wd leafs.

FWIW, the closest I've ever seen to a manufacturer allowing their 33x12.5's to be run on 15x7's is here: Those factory sponsored Jeeps, with factory sponsored Goodyear tires ran 33x12.5-15's on 15x7" wheels.

Some 33x12.5's fit OK on 7" wheels. Some 33x12.5's fit horribly on 7's. It's all what the tire was engineered for. When they design a tire, it's engineered for a specific bead spacing. Hopefully with a little wiggle room above, or below that number. Original style Bias 33x12.5-15" TSL's are a great example. In reality, they're under 12" wide, but their casing was engineered around a 15x10" wheel. Put them on a 15x8 (like I, and everyone else has), and they crown worse than most 12.5's do on a 7". It's not just a bias ply thing, since Bias TSL Q78's are only about 1" narrower, but fit on 15x6's like a glove, That casting was engineered to fit 6's. Reminds me of the sticky Dunlops that were on my first GSXR (motorcycle). In 1986 the most common track bike on the planet (GSXR750) came with narrow 18"x3.5" rear wheels & skinny (5.5") 140/70-18 tires. Wider 150's & 160's were designed for 4 & 4.5" wheels, and were a poor fit on the GSXR's narrow wheels. Dunlop stepped in with a huge (for the time) 6.6" wide 170/60-18 DOT sticky designed around those narrow little 3.5" hoops. They had to compromise sidewall angle (flatter is normally better for stability), but they were able to design in the tread profile, and width they needed, even with the huge disparity in tire vs wheel width. So, I have no doubt a 33x12.5" could be designed fit a 7" wheel, just like they could design one around a 12". Seems like most are spec'd for a 10-8.5" wheel, and going outside of that is a compromise. :smart:

I wouldn't do the swap expecting a MPG improvement with 31's. Do it for the improved acceleration, feeling of power, and in anticipation of the tire size jump later, but don't bank on getting better MPG with 31/4.10's or 4.65's vs 31/3.55's. Look at it this way, for sake of argument assume that 3.73's are the perfect all around ratio for MPG with 31's. (probably not true, but I bet it's close). If you do a ton of highway, and live in Florida (no hills), 31/3.55's, or even 31/3.07's would likely give you better gas mileage. If you live in a high altitude, do a ton of city driving, and there's hills everywhere, 31/4.10's, or even 31/4.56's would most likely give you better numbers. Once you jump to 33's, 4.10's would probably be close to an ideal ration, with average conditions. High altitude + lots of hills (you said Colorado, right?) 4.56's would be a better compromise. FWIW, I like taller gears for my daily drivers: Renix 4.0L/5spd 31/3.73's was my favorite combo, HO 4.0L/AW4 31/3.55's a close second (more power and auto shifts made up for the slightly taller gears). Renix 4.0L/5spd 31/4.56's wasn't as fun as I thought it would be (hitting 3rd gear by the time you hit the other side of an intersection gets old). Might not be as bad with the auto (since you're not doing the shifting), would probably be a ton of fun with a High Output/auto: more power at the top of the RPM band to put all that reving to good use. Either way tho, 31/4.56's can get buzzy at freeway speeds

Thanks guys. :cheers: I'm still smiling about it. :D

It's for kids, and our pack is kinda small, but today was a very cool day. Our first pinewood derby. :thumbsup: (Jake is a 6 yr old Tiger Cub) Can you tell which car is his? Hint, it kinda looks like this: :D Since he's the ONLY Tiger Cub in the pack, win, lose, or draw today, his car was going to go to the regionals (since Tigers, Wolves & Bear Cubs each send their fastest car). But he didn't have to sneak in on a technicality. Even though he's the youngest kid in the pack, his car won every race it was in, and set the MPH & ET records for the day. I don't know if the video's will post, but here are a few of the races: Final race of the three fastest cars: Proud papa here. :clapping:

Two ways to sell a lifted Jeep 1) Advertise it everywhere, wait forever, and hope for some dreamy eyed kid to travel 500 miles to buy your modified Jeep for full asking price 2) Return it to stock, and sell all the aftermarket stuff separately.