The86manche Posted April 24, 2020 Share Posted April 24, 2020 Sometime last year or the year before my grandmother had a saturn vue that was on its last legs.. literally. Leaky sun roof, failing electical and the motor shook bad at idle.. She loved the looks of the grand cherokee and asked me to find one for her to replace her old saturn. And so i did. I like the zjs myself but i figured id look for slightly more modern with a few more creature comforts the zjs don't all have(or work) for my grandmother. Ended up finding an 03 grand cherokee laredo. 173k miles 4.0 auto selectable 4x4 No 4.7 crap and no all wheel drive. The one i found had some nice options for a laredo too which i found surprising! Heated seats, tan leather, and a sunroof. PERFECT! The only issue it had was rust. It was a jeep that spent its life in maine by the ocean... It had plastic rocker covers that had enough sand to make another beach! And no rockers behind them.. The unibody was solid otherwise though. But small details for a running, driving, clean titled jeep with a tall stack of service paperwork for $600 right? ...right... I domt have any good photos of the jeep but i have tons for the work i did starting with the rockers! The rockers were rotted all the way through So slowly stitched together the back, center and fromt halfs of the rockers starting on the drover side. Ill say it went well. There is only one company that makes factory like rockers for this jeep unless you wanna empty your bank account for factory ones.. Anyway, driver side went quite smoothly and came out great! I did not leave it grey and i did not have any intentions of putting the plastic rocker covers back on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The86manche Posted April 24, 2020 Author Share Posted April 24, 2020 Sadly i don't have any in progress phots of the passenger side.. just finished product And then i found some good parts in the boneyard to replace the rust holding the gas tank and trans in place as well I really don't know how the gas tank was being held up.. Things were going well. I was pretty much all done with patching up the jeep, ready for my grandmother to get behind the wheel! And then.. i pulled the jeep out of my driveway so that i could sweep and clean all the rust and crap up, and in front of my house and let it run as it had sat for a while when it was being repaired.. and i heard a loud bang.. and ALL of the coolant was suddenly running down the street. The motor had blown. Somehow. and it took the radiator out with it. Blew out the side of the radiator in a way ive never seen before.. So it went from rockers to a motor swap Out with the old And in with the new(used) What made this engine swap even greater was the fact that i had to get it done in one night as the very next morning i was on a plane to disney! And i did it. But i never want to do that again. Engine ran great! Got it all buttoned up at 12am and drove it to my grandmothers house, down the highway about 20 minutes away. Everything checked out fine except for a loose clamp on a trans line. Took care of that and i was on my way to disney! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The86manche Posted April 24, 2020 Author Share Posted April 24, 2020 About two months go by and i get a call that the jeep had broke down in a parking lot. Coolant exploded everywhere. Where it sat in its coolant puddle of shame. The upper radiator hose had ruptured. Replaced it and topped off the cooling system and it started bubbling steaming and sucking coolant into somewhere. Headgasket had blown again! On a different engine! I decided to try and do a head swap instead to keep the repair cheap and because doing a motor swap on a wj is a nightmare... its not fun or easy. I domt have any photos but needless to say the head swap was a failure.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The86manche Posted April 24, 2020 Author Share Posted April 24, 2020 Okay so so far this jeep has eaten two good engines.. and how? Why? I had no idea. It was on to engine number 3. This engine i got from a reputable source. A local yard that is very nice and does not scam. They sold me a nice 4.0 from an 03 with 113k miles with a 90 day warranty, had it on their shelf ready to go. Took me 3 weeks of off and on work to go there yank the motor, put the new one in and finish it up, with the help of two other people. I put a 185 tstat in to decrease the chance of it overheating and poured seafoam down both downpipe cats(it was a lovely smokeshow) That was fall last year, the engine is still in it and running really good! ...except coolant keeps "disappering" I'm not sure how or where but its been plaguing me since the engine went in.. Its not a blown headgasket. The motor has not overheated. Theres no sticky sweet smell of coolant in the exhaust. The oil was not milkshake. And i even ran a compression/leak down test of each cylinder. And while doing that found out the spark plugs were all fouled. The dipstick looked the same, dirty but not milkshake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The86manche Posted April 24, 2020 Author Share Posted April 24, 2020 Cylinder #1 and its respective spark plug. I left compression in each cylinder for at least 20 minutes at a time Cylinder #2 Cyl. #3 Cyl. #4 Cyl. #5 And stupid me i forgot to take a picture of cylinder number 6 I don't know how this engine ran on these spark plugs but somehow it did.. After the compression test i threw new spark plugs in, champions of course. I also discovered the overflow tank was clogged. Fixed that too. Now my problem is.. its still making coolant magically "disappere!" I'm stumped! I have no idea what else to do.. I'm thinking of putting another new thermostat in, replacing the waterpump and flushing the system but does anyone have any suggestions where i should look? Everyone on facebook says blown motor but its clearly not with everything ive done to prove its fine so i can't trust them lol S.O.S. HELP WITH SUGGESTIONS GUYS THIS JEEP HAS BEEN THE BANE OF MY EXISTANCE SINCE I TOUCHED IT (I can't make this photo go away lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dzimm Posted April 24, 2020 Share Posted April 24, 2020 New cooling parts and flushing won't do anything for your problem if it's not leaking on the ground. This is definitely strange... I'm wondering if the head is cracked or the head gasket is blown between a cylinder and water jacket. It may only open up enough to leak when the engine is at operating temp, it would then be burning the coolant. This would be more likely with a cracked head. I'd get it up to operating temp and then do compression test quickly to see what it is warm. Does the oil level go up on the dipstick at all? Another thing to check is the passenger floorboard. I'm not sure how the heater box is setup on the Grand Cherokee but on the XJ/MJ it would leak onto the floor on the passenger side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The86manche Posted April 24, 2020 Author Share Posted April 24, 2020 I myself don't see it leakiing on the ground. However there is signs of weaping from hose ends with clamps on them. Like one of the heater hoses into the water pump. I didnt see a crack in the cylinder. And they are known to crack between cyl. 3 and 4 Its a tuppy head. It never passes 210 and when it is hot the exhaust doesnt smell like coolant either. No white smoke and i even checked in the cab but not wet spots or smell of coolant in the cab. The motor only has about 117k miles now since i put it in last year.. my grandmother down not drive it much at all. So I'm baffled as to how the head gasket could fail in 4k miles? That would mean the motor was bad from the get go from the yard. And they test their motors before they sell them they don't just yank them out of cars randomly. And i don't think oil goes up the dipstick honestly. The only thing i noticed is the hoses get a little too pressured when its hot. Or maybe its me but the hoses seem a little to stiff. Oh yeah, it also has a new radiator cap But i can try doing a hot compression test. That won't be fun though lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete M Posted April 24, 2020 Share Posted April 24, 2020 I don't have a solution to this weird dilemma, but I can say that the temp rating on a t-stat controls the low temp, not the high temp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ωhm Posted April 24, 2020 Share Posted April 24, 2020 18 minutes ago, Dzimm said: Another thing to check is the passenger floorboard. I'm not sure how the heater box is setup on the Grand Cherokee but on the XJ/MJ it would leak onto the floor on the passenger side. ^^^^Good advice^^^^ 28 minutes ago, The86manche said: I also discovered the overflow tank was clogged. Fixed that too. Check the hose between tank and radiator. 29 minutes ago, The86manche said: I don't know how this engine ran on these spark plugs but somehow it did. Fixing the clogged overflow tank and replacing the spark plugs, time for a test drive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dzimm Posted April 24, 2020 Share Posted April 24, 2020 7 minutes ago, The86manche said: I myself don't see it leakiing on the ground. However there is signs of weaping from hose ends with clamps on them. Like one of the heater hoses into the water pump. I didnt see a crack in the cylinder. And they are known to crack between cyl. 3 and 4 Its a tuppy head. It never passes 210 and when it is hot the exhaust doesnt smell like coolant either. No white smoke and i even checked in the cab but not wet spots or smell of coolant in the cab. The motor only has about 117k miles now since i put it in last year.. my grandmother down not drive it much at all. So I'm baffled as to how the head gasket could fail in 4k miles? That would mean the motor was bad from the get go from the yard. And they test their motors before they sell them they don't just yank them out of cars randomly. And i don't think oil goes up the dipstick honestly. The only thing i noticed is the hoses get a little too pressured when its hot. Or maybe its me but the hoses seem a little to stiff. Oh yeah, it also has a new radiator cap But i can try doing a hot compression test. That won't be fun though lol My 95XJ head cracked between cylinder 3 and 4 and it used a little coolant. Ran like crap though so I knew it was a problem. After almost 2 years of driving it this way it finally started to put coolant into the oil and create chocolate milk so I knew it was time. Replaced with a junkyard head and solved all issues. I'd say just pull the head and get it magnafluxed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The86manche Posted April 24, 2020 Author Share Posted April 24, 2020 5 minutes ago, Ωhm said: ^^^^Good advice^^^^ Check the hose between tank and radiator. Fixing the clogged overflow tank and replacing the spark plugs, time for a test drive. Passenger floorboard was dry. And i have checked it many times in the hopes that is it. It also doesnt smell like coolant in the cab. That was how i found out the tank was clogged. Couldnt blow into it. Fixed the clog and i could easily blow bubbles into the tank. This was a couple weeks ago i did this. My grandmother said it was running great with the new plugs but the other day she told me it was low on coolant again. I had checked the oil and still no milkshake so i topped the cooling system and scratched my head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The86manche Posted April 24, 2020 Author Share Posted April 24, 2020 5 minutes ago, Dzimm said: My 95XJ head cracked between cylinder 3 and 4 and it used a little coolant. Ran like crap though so I knew it was a problem. After almost 2 years of driving it this way it finally started to put coolant into the oil and create chocolate milk so I knew it was time. Replaced with a junkyard head and solved all issues. I'd say just pull the head and get it magnafluxed. The engine runs like a top though, no sputtering or backfiring at all. The motor came out of a junkyard but a reputable one and its only been driven about 5k miles since installed. It was a tested good motor before it was sold to me. And that would leave her down a vehicle and my pockets empty.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ωhm Posted April 24, 2020 Share Posted April 24, 2020 7 minutes ago, The86manche said: This was a couple weeks ago i did this. My grandmother said it was running great with the new plugs but the other day she told me it was low on coolant again. Couple of weeks is a good stretch. How much coolant did you need to add? When engine is up to normal operating temperature, check/watch for air bubbles in the overflow tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The86manche Posted April 24, 2020 Author Share Posted April 24, 2020 22 minutes ago, Pete M said: I don't have a solution to this weird dilemma, but I can say that the temp rating on a t-stat controls the low temp, not the high temp. Well temp gauge reads about 190 and never past that, and cooling fan kicks on too But thank you for the info pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The86manche Posted April 24, 2020 Author Share Posted April 24, 2020 1 minute ago, Ωhm said: Couple of weeks is a good stretch. How much coolant did you need to add? When engine is up to normal operating temperature, check for air bubbles in the overflow tank. It is quite a stretch. It had some coolant left so i filled a gallon with water and poured it in and into the overflow. And thats the weird thing, thats one of the few things i am looking for but it never bubbles. With the cap off with it running the coolant wants to just flow out but its not bubbling out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete M Posted April 24, 2020 Share Posted April 24, 2020 I'm just saying, once the t-stat opens, it affects nothing. is it normally a 185? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dzimm Posted April 24, 2020 Share Posted April 24, 2020 How quickly is it using coolant? Like you can watch it drop or it takes it a few weeks/month? Freeze plug in the back of the head leaking and dripping onto the exhaust causing it to evaporate? I'm just throwing ideas out at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ωhm Posted April 24, 2020 Share Posted April 24, 2020 Steam came into my mind also. Might have to follow the story told by the spark plugs. Check them every time you add coolant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The86manche Posted April 24, 2020 Author Share Posted April 24, 2020 18 minutes ago, Pete M said: I'm just saying, once the t-stat opens, it affects nothing. is it normally a 185? 180/185 something like that. Its bellow the 195 temp rated tstat because i wanted it to try amd run cooler. Which it has Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The86manche Posted April 24, 2020 Author Share Posted April 24, 2020 18 minutes ago, Dzimm said: How quickly is it using coolant? Like you can watch it drop or it takes it a few weeks/month? Freeze plug in the back of the head leaking and dripping onto the exhaust causing it to evaporate? I'm just throwing ideas out at this point. Its slow, it takes a few weeks before it says low coolant. Time stamp on the photos on my phone say march 27th actually. But she told me since covid she only drives jt once a week. Rarely twice. I can't see anything drop while its running or cooling off honestly. Its really mindboggling to me.. And i appreciate any and all ideas at this point. I can't really say about the freeze plug.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The86manche Posted April 24, 2020 Author Share Posted April 24, 2020 9 minutes ago, Ωhm said: Steam came into my mind also. Might have to follow the story told by the spark plugs. Check them every time you add coolant. can't recall if theres steam honestly.. Ill do that. I almost feel like letting it run with the cap off and letting it dump into a bucket to see what it does Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdog Posted April 24, 2020 Share Posted April 24, 2020 perform a pressure test on the cooling system, pretty sure you can rent the tools but don't quote me on that. get the system pressurized and let it sit and see if it drops, if so start looking for coolant drips if not pressurize the cap, just cause its new doesn't mean its good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvertwinkiehobo Posted June 4, 2020 Share Posted June 4, 2020 I've had experiences with 4.0L cooling systems. But I also have experience with EFI, and running an EFI with a 'cooler' t-stat only makes the system run richer. That's why the plugs are a darker brown than normal. As for the cooling system, the rear head and the rear block freeze plugs (especially the block one--I once found one with casting sand in the block!) get rotted on the bottom and begin to weep when hot pressurized. Same with aluminum/plastic radiators; they can open up when heated and pressurized. Using a pressure tester has a great chance of showing any leaks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The86manche Posted June 27, 2020 Author Share Posted June 27, 2020 AN UPDATE! a long overdue one at that.. I finally found the issue! And now i need to figure out why!? The headgasket popped on the motor with only 116k miles on it! And the heater core too.. greaaaattt... I picked up a combustion chamber leak detection kit and it gave me my answer. That and when the tstat opened the coolant violently bubbled out.. This motor was good when purchased and was good for a while after installing it. And not once did it overheat.. My confusion and aggravation now is.. WHAT THE MADE 3 ENGINES POP?!?!?!?! Could the cats be clogged and causing excessive backpressure out the headgasket? Thats the only thing i can think of thats caused THREE different motors to pop.. But what do you guys think could have caused this motor to go too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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