A-man930 Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 What are some possible reasons that my clutch engages just fine sometimes, and other times it's grabby and chatters like crazy?? I know it aint my driving since I've had it for quite a while now. The clutch was replaced before I bought it, and when I had everything out last week it looked fine. Could it just be a cheap kit and the friction material crappy? Or does that matter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLHTAZ Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 If the previous clutch created hot spots on the flywheel and it was not resurfaced or replaced, you will have exactly the problem that you are describing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 If the previous clutch created hot spots on the flywheel and it was not resurfaced or replaced, you will have exactly the problem that you are describing. And since the FSM specifically says not to resurface the flywheel, that's not really an option, either. That causes incomplete disengagement, which in turn may result in ... hot spots. Or a broken tranny -- take your pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-man930 Posted May 26, 2008 Author Share Posted May 26, 2008 Now that I think about it, it doesn't start acting up until I've been driving for a while, time for hot spots? I'm not really excited about the idea of a new flywheel, a clutch disc would be cheaper (I assume). Is that even a likeley culprit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 A clutch disk is probably $12 to $15 ... but it's not likely the problem. The problem is much more likely to be a hot-spotted flywheel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildman Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 The Clutch disk alone is $35. I too have this same problem on the '89 and last year when I had everything apart, I only replaced the clutch disk, and seen the 'hot spots' on the flywheel, but just opp'ed to go this route at the time. Concerning that a whole clutch set is around $135, this is not a good choice just to replace the disk it's self. The fly wheel runs around $88. My clutch only chatters when I get stuck in stop and go traffic, or after running for a good 20 miles. I've found that sitting at a red light, if I just take it out of gear, and let the clutch out while sitting, It don't chatter as bad when I do put it in gear and take off. Yes, when time comes and it's time to "re-do" every thing, I will be replacing the flywheel, and a complete clutch set. Plus, this '89 MJ only had 85K on the clock last year, but the disk was so glazed over that's the reason I only replaced the disk. Bad mistake :cry: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 The problem is that many people today don't know how to drive a standard. They think it's smart to hold the vehicle on a hill by slipping the clutch, for example. This is what wears out clutches and creates hot spots in the flywheel. When I was in college, I had a fraternity brother who had a Chevy Impala 327 4-speed. He moaned and groaned loud and long because he had gone through three clutches in 13,000 miles and the dealer wouldn't replace the clutch under warranty. He told the whole world that Chevy made lousy cars with lousy clutches. So one night several of us went out for pizza. The house driveway was long, and sloped uphill. He had to back out. To do so, he revved it up to about 3,000 RPM and slipped the clutch all the way up the driveway. He also used the clutch to hold the car on hills at stoplights. Small wonder he went through clutches like most people go through Kleenex. I replaced the clutch in the '88 XJ at 204,000 miles. The clutch looked brand new, but the slave cylinder had gone and it didn't make sense with everything apart NOT to replace the clutch. No hotspots on the flywheel, so I didn't replace it, and I have no chatter. But I learned to drive a standard from my grandfather, who never owned an automatic until he was in his 70s. He drummed into our heads that a clutch should either be disengaged, or completely engaged. If you slip it, you kill it. My '88 MJ, on the other hand, cannot be driven without chattering. It's the ONLY vehicle I've ever driven that I cannot start off in 1st gear smoothly, and it irritates me no end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mvusse Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 Clutch chatter can also be cause by a bad/bent pressure plate. In this case replacing flywheel and/or clutch plate will not fix things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-man930 Posted May 27, 2008 Author Share Posted May 27, 2008 Eagle I'm with you, I was taught how to drive a manual correctly, I can't stand being in a car with someone who does it wrong. I'm going to ask the previous owner wether the pressure plate and/or flywheel is new or not, hopefully I can narrow it down before I go wasting money. Will you always be able to see "hotspots"? My Dad and I didn't notice anything unusual when we had everything apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brigarpeon Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 Have you tried bleeding the clutch slave cylinder? You may have a little air that is cavitating the fluid. If it goes away briefly then comes back you will need to replace the slave cylinder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-man930 Posted May 29, 2008 Author Share Posted May 29, 2008 I bled the slave pretty thoroughly when I was re-installing everything the other day. Besides, wouldn't air in the system would cause funky-ness all the time, not just when it gets warm? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brigarpeon Posted May 29, 2008 Share Posted May 29, 2008 I bled the slave pretty thoroughly when I was re-installing everything the other day. Besides, wouldn't air in the system would cause funky-ness all the time, not just when it gets warm? NOPE. It would work just like your brakes when they need bled, fine after you pump it, just like my ol lady! But as you travel and use it frequently it stays fine. Drive 30+ miles and not shift it gets "funky" again. But as I said b4 if the diaphram is failing it will let the fluid equalize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
135Boom Posted May 29, 2008 Share Posted May 29, 2008 ........mine does the same thing, only when its hot. When its cool, or hasnt been used much it doesnt do it, but in stop and go traffic, YOU BET! Let me know what you end up doing. Pretty sure its hot spots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-man930 Posted May 30, 2008 Author Share Posted May 30, 2008 So let me get this straight, a little air in the clutch hydrolics wouldn't necessarily cause any ill effects untill the system gets hot? The slave is pretty new and it looked fine... I'll try bleeding it again and see what happens. I got in touch with the previous owner and he said that he had the pressure plate re-surfaced, not replaced. But he says it never gave him trouble, and since I didn't notice anything weird when I had it out, should I really expect anything to be wrong with it?? Warpage or hot spots would be visable right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 He had the pressureplate resurfaced? Man, I have NEVER heard of that. The FSM specifically warns not to resurface the flywheel, but they don't even mention resurfacing the pressure plate. That is truly redneck. Unbelievable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geonovast Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 He had the pressureplate resurfaced? Man, I have NEVER heard of that. The FSM specifically warns not to resurface the flywheel, but they don't even mention resurfacing the pressure plate. That is truly redneck. Unbelievable. I had been taught to replace the PP whenever the clutch is replaced. It makes sense, since clutch kits usually come with one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiNi Beast Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 He had the pressureplate resurfaced? Man, I have NEVER heard of that. The FSM specifically warns not to resurface the flywheel, but they don't even mention resurfacing the pressure plate. That is truly redneck. Unbelievable. I saw that in the FSM, but in Haynes it recommends it to be resurfaced at a local machine shop. :nuts: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-man930 Posted May 30, 2008 Author Share Posted May 30, 2008 I was wondering the same thing! Turns out he was confused, he had the flywheel resurfaced before he saw that you weren't supposed to. Would this be my problem? Again, I did not see anything wrong with it... Also, he evidently did not replace any of the hydraulics, so that opens those up to question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted May 31, 2008 Share Posted May 31, 2008 I saw that in the FSM, but in Haynes it recommends it to be resurfaced at a local machine shop. :nuts: Yeah, I always believe a $15 generic repair book over the $90 factory-authorized repair manual written by the people who built the vehicle and used in the factory-authorized repair shops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiNi Beast Posted May 31, 2008 Share Posted May 31, 2008 I saw that in the FSM, but in Haynes it recommends it to be resurfaced at a local machine shop. :nuts: Yeah, I always believe a $15 generic repair book over the $90 factory-authorized repair manual written by the people who built the vehicle and used in the factory-authorized repair shops. :laughin: of course always! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-man930 Posted June 1, 2008 Author Share Posted June 1, 2008 Ok, after talking to him again, here are the "new" parts he installed: disc slave cyl throwout bearing pilot bearing pressure plate Which leaves me with the flywheel as the most likely source of the problem... but no one has answered my question. Will warpage/hotspots always be visable?! I've heard you'll see blue-ish spots if heat related damage has occoured... this is the only reason I'm not entirely convinced, I was looking at the flywheel just two weeks ago (as was my dad), and there was nothing aparent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiNi Beast Posted June 1, 2008 Share Posted June 1, 2008 Was the clutch disc put on in the right, the right face facing out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLHTAZ Posted June 1, 2008 Share Posted June 1, 2008 Hot spots are typically visible, but warpage is not always able to be seen by eye. A good straight edge can usually tell the story there though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-man930 Posted June 2, 2008 Author Share Posted June 2, 2008 Yes, the "flywheel side" of the disc was labeled. I'll go ahead and get a new flywheel ordered tonight. I'll keep everyone updated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiNi Beast Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 Yes, the "flywheel side" of the disc was labeled. I'll go ahead and get a new flywheel ordered tonight. I'll keep everyone updated. :thumbsup: Sucks though being you have to tear it all back down. But gives you some good experience. Look at me, did my tranny swap in a matter of a few hrs, other the whole pilot bushing crap. But still sucks either way after doing it once. May I also suggest double checking everything over again and ensuring it is all good, maybe change the front seal on the tranny or heck maybe even the rear main seal, be easy with the tranny out. Or not. I'm just one that does everything I can when I tear something down, to ensure I won't do it again the next week. :cheers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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