crashdocs Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 Ok I'm new here but have been working on my 87 Comanche Pioneer 4.0 4x4 now for the past year and it is almost ready for paint next month. Until then I wanted to do a little interior work and change from black to tan, swap out the bench for some buckets, add a center console and get rid of the idiot lights. I don't care much for the speedo cable, I broke the cable where it fits into the back of the speedometer. I would rather just change it out with a newer cluster and bypass the cable? Is that possible? I know I need a sensor fro the temp guage and the oil sensor but I want to focus on the speedo cable. How can I do this? Oh i should get some pics on here next week when I get back into town. Thanks for the help in advance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 I have never heard of anyone replacing the mechanical speedo with an electronic one. I suppose it can be done if the electronic one runs directly off the electrical feed from the sensor in the transfer case, but I don't know if that's the case. If the speedo runs on a data signal that comes through the ECU, you're hosed. Even if it's possible, it's going to take a bit of work. Personally, I'd buy a new speedo cable and call it good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshmillslane Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 Hijack alert! You are switching FROM black?!?! Jeeze, you'd be able to sell that interior here in about 2 seconds. Factory black seems to be hard to find. Damn, wish I was close to KC and could get the black bench from you. I'm going to have to throw a cover on mine. Interested in selling the black rear trim panels? I'm about to paint mine, and one is broken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLHTAZ Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 Changing to the electronic will take a lot of work. You can still get the speedo cables at the dealership if you can't find a good used one...you just need to know if it has cruise control or not. I just did the swap to the full gauge set up on mine. It is not hard except for getting that speedo cable off of the old one as I too broke it, but I was able to get it back in without needing a new cable. My speedo has a little woble to it, so I am going to get a new cable sometime...but, it works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashdocs Posted January 20, 2008 Author Share Posted January 20, 2008 ok so I guess I should really look for a cable from an xj and upgrade from there. There's about 8-10 here and one i'm still pulling stuff off. need the upper dash and I shoul be finished with it. Too cold to really spend some quality time these recently departed jeeps. anyone need anything while i'm out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashdocs Posted January 30, 2008 Author Share Posted January 30, 2008 8) okay pulled out the old guage cluster and popped in the other, I stuck with the cable type) matched up just fine. changed the oil pressure sensor and the temp sensor. hmmmm nothin really working, just the speedo, back lights, turn signal, brights. unplugged it and noticed different pin locations for the wire plugs. So could it possibly be this will not work as easily as was described on a thread I found here LOL. I'll include a few pics to show my problems. On the interior swap, not too bad, swapped out the upper and lower dash and trim parts. Looks real good, made sure I got the ones with some wood trim. have not done the seats yet, got cold again before I got that part done. So here's the pics on the cluster swap. the top one is the new one, the bottom is what my 87 comanche had in it both were 4.0 not sure on the year but I want to say 88-90 atlaeast. if I need to run out to u-pick it I could and probably cut the plugs off to know what goes where if I ned to re-pin them. ok now a couple close ups old one new one sorry if they are fuzzy, only had my phone handy hmmmmany help out there would be appreciated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geonovast Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 You'd have to stick with the cable type, just fyi. The entire cluster is different from the Renix to the Chrystler systems, they even use a different plug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLHTAZ Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 In 1987 there was 3 different clusters used :roll: . Only one of the three is compatible with later year models unfotunately. It appears that you will have to either do a little research and figure out how to re-wire your harness to make it work or find another cluster that matches up. It looks like you have one that is not compatible with any other year than '87 :cry: . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragonrider477 Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 my speedometer cable also broke when i pulled my cluster out to swap in the guage cluster.it separated where the cable housing slides into the end that clips into the back of the speedometer.my cheapness said "no new part needed here".i took some 99 cent on sale harbor freight 2 part epoxy and repaired it.works fine.there are only like 2 or 3 harbor freight retail stores in the whole state of tn. i am blessed with one of these stores only 15 min. from my house. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLHTAZ Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 my speedometer cable also broke when i pulled my cluster out to swap in the guage cluster.it separated where the cable housing slides into the end that clips into the back of the speedometer.my cheapness said "no new part needed here".i took some 99 cent on sale harbor freight 2 part epoxy and repaired it.works fine.there are only like 2 or 3 harbor freight retail stores in the whole state of tn. i am blessed with one of these stores only 15 min. from my house.I made that mistake too. I just pushed in back in and left it alone and it works fine as once it is installed back in the dash it can't move anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 No rewiring should be necessary. My friend in Greece put an '88 or '89 6-cylinder cluster into an '84 XJ 4-cylinder and it worked fine. All he had to do was adjust the potentiometer to calibrate the tach to the 4-cylinder engine. What makes you think some of the pins are wired differently? The cluster swap has been done hundreds of times and nobody has ever reported that. Okay, I see the difference in the pictures. Before you go tearing things apart, trace those circuits and see what they feed. That may simply be the difference between idiot lights and gauges. Check your plug to be sure none of your contacts are corroded or bad. Does the plug have contacts where the OLD cluster was blank and the new one has contacts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiatslug87 Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 As Eagle stated the difference is that gauges and the tach require extra circuits. The back of my “old” ones and “new” ones looked just like yours. Either you’re not making good contact or there may be a problem with the new cluster (probably unlikely). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashdocs Posted January 30, 2008 Author Share Posted January 30, 2008 I'll run down to the yard and just cut out those harness pplugs so that I can try to get the pins to match up right. Yes, I have contacts where none were before and some where there were none and now are. No corrosion on the contacts, look really clean and all. I'll take some additional pics later of both and we'll see where we are. thanks for the help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete M Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 You shouldn't need the other harness. I vaguely remember this issue popping up years ago and I believe the problem turned out to be a bad circuit card in the new cluster. The clusters should swap out directly and as long as the temp and pressure senders are swapped in, everything should work without any wiring changes. If it doesn't work, somethings broken. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaekl Posted January 30, 2008 Share Posted January 30, 2008 It is hard to understand the many changes that even AMC made to the cluster over the years. I investigated this very thoroughly in 1986. After studing the wiring diagram, I determined the the vehicle's wiring is compatible for no gauges or full gauge cluster. The junkyard yielded a 85 cluster and worked great in a 86 Cherokee, but the design of the gauges were different due to a cost reduction in gauge design. When I got my 88 MJ and plugged in a earlier full cluster everything worked except the speedo due to cable change. However you can't put a post 87 speedo in a older cluster because the plastic housing is different. Within a given a year I think there are 3 different housings/circuits, no gauge, no tach, and full. You can't just plug in a smaller fuel gauge and a tach, it's a different cluster. From what I've seen/done all (blue face) clusters are electrically interchangeable but have physical differences. If the plug fits, it should work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiatslug87 Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 However you can't put a post 87 speedo in a older cluster because the plastic housing is different. Actually you can, you just have to shim the speedometer and change one of the contacts (I think I had to add a jumper wire). I like the look of the blue face gauges (with the x100 tach); my '88 had the blue gauges but no tach. I found what I assumed was an 86 full cluster and swapped my speedo into it because of the cable connection difference. Everything works great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashdocs Posted January 31, 2008 Author Share Posted January 31, 2008 didn't make it to the yard today but will tomorrow, thanks for all the input.... I have them side by side again pondering over ideas. I'll plug em back up and see if I get anything again here in a few. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 Before you go buying more clusters, or clipping connectors that are going to be the same as what you already have in the vehicle, try testing the gauges. You can use a 9-volt transistor battery. For the voltmeter, just connect direct to the two contacts on the gauge itself and see if the gauge reads anywhere near 9 volts. For the oil and temp senders, same deal -- connect direct to the gauge. Dunno which polarity is which. Connect one way, the needles should stay to the left, reverse the polarity and the nedles should move pretty far over to the right. (If you do it with a 12-volt source, they should go all the way to the right.) If the battery moves the needles, then get a digital ohm meter and check the printed circuit traces from each contact point at the connector plug to the points where the gauges connect. Be sure you have continuity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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