AW4 Transmission Problem

[Jeep Driver]

9 minutes ago, Griff04 said:

 

First of all let’s get something straight...I appreciate everyone’s input and suggestions. 

 

Secondly, your comment about “you keep telling me, you keep ignoring me” is totally off base. I’m not quite sure what kind of “tone” was behind that but I’m a grown man, I would appreciate it if you don’t talk down to me like I’m some kind of kid. If you have an issue with this then I’ll put it politely, bug-off. 

 

Thirdly, there are currently 3, yes 3, early model Cherokees with autos in them, probably the AW4s, sitting in the U-Pull-It yard, in my hometown, Albany Ga, in the SE as you put it, that I could probably get. 

 

So I have a hard time believing that parts are completely drying up. I’m in agreement with HOrnbrod, they are just getting a little harder to come by. 

 

Griff04

Here, today, the first 80s XJ to arrive at our PullaPart in two years. 

That's right, two years. 

 

This is an indicator. 

 

And I have posted this link before, stated the same just about a week or so ago regarding no XJs. 

 

https://www.pullapart.com/inventory/search/?LocationID=10&MakeID=29&ModelID=239&LocationPage=true

[Griff04]

4 minutes ago, Jeep Driver said:

You do realize that I was not even speaking to you? or about you? nor was I addressing anything you said?

 

You realize that, right?

 

 

 

Honestly I thought you were speaking to, please accept my apology. 

[Griff04]

39 minutes ago, HOrnbrod said:

Rape and pillage - that's good.  

 

Yea, that’s a good one, didn’t know you had some “Viking” blood in you lol 

 

A quick question, maybe you can help, I believe I read somewhere that the AW4 had changes made in 91?  Exactly what year(s) would be a plug and play for my 88?

 

thanks

Griff04

[Jeep Driver]

7 minutes ago, Griff04 said:

 

Yea, that’s a good one, didn’t know you had some “Viking” blood in you lol 

 

A quick question, maybe you can help, I believe I read somewhere that the AW4 had changes made in 91?  Exactly what year(s) would be a plug and play for my 88?

 

thanks

Griff04

87-90

[HOrnbrod]

Virtually any AW4 used for your configuration (88, 4.0, 4x4) will work provided you use the matching TCU. They all function identically but there were some slight pin number changes in the wiring between the tranny and the controller. With a wiring diagram it's simple to match the transmission and it's controller.

 

I just looked at our local jeep yard inventory for AW4's with your config - they have 14 transmissions available.

[Griff04]

1 minute ago, Jeep Driver said:

87-90

 

Thanks JD, sorry for the misunderstanding. 

[Jeep Driver]

Just now, Griff04 said:

 

Thanks JD, sorry for the misunderstanding. 

No sweat. 

[Griff04]

11 minutes ago, HOrnbrod said:

Virtually any AW4 used for your configuration (88, 4.0, 4x4) will work provided you use the matching TCU. They all function identically but there were some slight pin number changes in the wiring between the tranny and the controller. With a wiring diagram it's simple to match the transmission and it's controller.

 

I just looked at our local jeep yard for AW4's with your config - they have 14 transmissions listed.

 

Which local Jeep yard are you referring to?

[HOrnbrod]

http://www.completeautorecyclers.com/

[Jeep Driver]

2 hours ago, HOrnbrod said:

http://www.completeautorecyclers.com/

Date Acquired

4/1/2004 5:00:00 AM

https://completeauto.hollanderstores.com/used-auto-parts/1990/jeep/comanche/transmission/400-transmission-transaxle/400-02223-at,-4x4,-6-cylinder/part-349280-816-1

 

Do you realize that of the 14 the only one with a 'fair' condition has been sitting on a shelf for 14 years? 

Not only on a shelf but on a shelf dry for 14 years? No fluids for 14 years?

 

This is why I keep refuting the canned answers you guys give. 

 

Their best transmission is trash, at best it's a core, nothing more. 

[HOrnbrod]

Yep, that was just an example, there are plenty available if you look past your rape and pillage drama. That was funny though.   The trannys are sealed when stored, and you are not even close to an AW4 expert to assess their condition.

 

OP, there are plenty of good usable AW4's available to swap in if you look. It's not a problem, happens every day, in spite of what the doom and gloom people say.

[Jeep Driver]

Griff, you're grown man, you'll figure it out yourself. The only reason I get involved in any of these threads is because I've been in your shoes many times and I've screwed myself royal over stupid mistakes. 

 

The reason the shop is giving you the big F is because you had the truck towed in, they have you by the sack. 

 

Pull the transmission yourself, drop in on their bench and tell them to rebuild it, do it with attitude like you done it before, don't let them dick you around with a phone call later and an estimate BS. You'll likely settle for around $800. New TC for $180, fluids and misc- $80 or so.

You'll get out of this for under $1100. 

 

 

The problem with the other canned answer- carpart.com

 

You want a grade A low miles trans with a guarantee. 

You shop a dozen or so, hem-n-haw, throw a dart, make a couple of phone calls. Joe in TX sounds honest, he swears up and down he's got the best used trans in the country.

You bite. 

Trans- $600

Freight-$200

Labor- $400 (you stated)

Fluids and misc- $80

Total- $1280

 

80% chance you'll be fine. 

20% you aint' fine. 

 

Lets say you ain't fine, trans is bad-

Labor to remove $$$$

You freight return-$200

Who freights the warranted trans back to you:?????

Who pays for reinstall?

And all this takes two weeks. 

 

Suddenly that $1100 looks real cheap, doesn't it?

 

 

People with canned answers never really tell you the whole story, do they?

[Jeep Driver]

15 minutes ago, HOrnbrod said:

Yep, that was just an example, there are plenty available if you look past your rape and pillage drama. That was funny though.   The trannys are sealed when stored, and you are not even close to an AW4 expert to assess their condition.

 

OP, there are plenty of good usable AW4's available to swap in if you look. It's not a problem, happens every day, in spite of what the doom and gloom people say.

Edit: you had time to read it. 

[Griff04]

32 minutes ago, Jeep Driver said:

Griff, you're grown man, you'll figure it out yourself. The only reason I get involved in any of these threads is because I've been in your shoes many times and I've screwed myself royal over stupid mistakes. 

 

The reason the shop is giving you the big F is because you had the truck towed in, they have you by the sack. 

 

Pull the transmission yourself, drop in on their bench and tell them to rebuild it, do it with attitude like you done it before, don't let them dick you around with a phone call later and an estimate BS. You'll likely settle for around $800. New TC for $180, fluids and misc- $80 or so.

You'll get out of this for under $1100. 

 

 

The problem with the other canned answer- carpart.com

 

You want a grade A low miles trans with a guarantee. 

You shop a dozen or so, hem-n-haw, throw a dart, make a couple of phone calls. Joe in TX sounds honest, he swears up and down he's got the best used trans in the country.

You bite. 

Trans- $600

Freight-$200

Labor- $400 (you stated)

Fluids and misc- $80

Total- $1280

 

80% chance you'll be fine. 

20% you aint' fine. 

 

Lets say you ain't fine, trans is bad-

Labor to remove $$$$

You freight return-$200

Who freights the warranted trans back to you:?????

Who pays for reinstall?

And all this takes two weeks. 

 

Suddenly that $1100 looks real cheap, doesn't it?

 

 

People with canned answers never really tell you the whole story, do they?

 

I’ve been around a long time, actually turned 61 today, used to think that was old, now I think it is young. I’ve seen a lot of things and been down a lot of roads along with all those “rabbit holes” you mentioned in your reply. In my younger days I’d make quick decisions which always came back to haunt me, nowadays I just take my time, my wife can’t stand it but it is what it is. 

 

My buddy owns a wrecker service so it didn’t cost me anything to get it to the shop and likewise on getting it back to the house. Will probably just have him drag it home tomorrow and then think on it a few days. I’ve been “wrenching” for 40+ years, replaced a couple of trannys but never built one, so doing the work wouldn’t be an issue but finding the time and energy would be. 

 

I’ll get it figured out!!

 

I appreciate everyone’s input. 

 

Thx,

Griff

[Pete M]

there's a couple threads with a ton of AW4 info in the link in my sig.  

[Griff04]

4 hours ago, Pete M said:

there's a couple threads with a ton of AW4 info in the link in my sig.  

Thanks Pete.  

[AZJeff]

19 hours ago, Jeep Driver said:

Date Acquired

4/1/2004 5:00:00 AM

https://completeauto.hollanderstores.com/used-auto-parts/1990/jeep/comanche/transmission/400-transmission-transaxle/400-02223-at,-4x4,-6-cylinder/part-349280-816-1

 

Do you realize that of the 14 the only one with a 'fair' condition has been sitting on a shelf for 14 years? 

Not only on a shelf but on a shelf dry for 14 years? No fluids for 14 years?

 

This is why I keep refuting the canned answers you guys give. 

 

Their best transmission is trash, at best it's a core, nothing more. 

I disagree with that assessment.

 

If a junkyard has pulled a trans and placed it in an enclosed area (no rain or dust storms), if the trans was working when pulled, it will be a FINE candidate for installation into another vehicle.

 

The internal parts will not corrode/rust/deteriorate if they were coated in ATF at the time of removal.  The rear and front seals might be dried out and needing replacing, but that is not big deal.  A new pan gasket and filter screen would be prudent anyhow.  

 

Once that is done, that AW-4 would be ready for transplant.

[Griff04]

1 hour ago, AZJeff said:

I disagree with that assessment.

 

If a junkyard has pulled a trans and placed it in an enclosed area (no rain or dust storms), if the trans was working when pulled, it will be a FINE candidate for installation into another vehicle.

 

The internal parts will not corrode/rust/deteriorate if they were coated in ATF at the time of removal.  The rear and front seals might be dried out and needing replacing, but that is not big deal.  A new pan gasket and filter screen would be prudent anyhow.  

 

Once that is done, that AW-4 would be ready for transplant.

 

For the most part all the local yards, 60 mile radius, have gone to a u-pull-it style service. This of course as you know means the tranny is left sitting in the vehicle. Now, is this good or bad, probably not as good as removing and properly storing them but as long as they are somewhat out of the element and not left laying around on the ground I think they should be okay? I’m definitely in agreement with doing a little maintenance on them such as replacing the seals, filter,  and pan gasket. 

 

Heck I don’t know, maybe I’m just trying to convince myself in getting a used one instead of shelling out close to $2k for a shop rebuild and install. With the intentions of pulling it myself I actually went to 2 other tranny shops in town today to see what they would charge me if I brought it to them, neither would touch it.

 

 GO FIGURE, THEY WANT ALL YOUR MONEY!!!

 

Can’t do nothing but laugh about it!!🤪

[Eagle]

Two grand for a tranny?

 

The AW4 is virtually indestructible  (if you keep fluid in it -- dig, dig). Instead of shopping junkyards, look around for a running XJ for sale. With luck you might find one for $500 or so, get a functional transmission, a spare transfer case, and maybe a bunch of other stuff you can use on the MJ.

[Griff04]

Found a used tranny through one of the guys at work. Donor is out of a 90 XJ with supposedly 145k on it, been sitting up for about 6 years after a blown motor, oil pump went out. 

 

The guy wants $175 with me pulling it. I figure $175 plus probably 6-8 hours of work vs $2k for a rebuild it’s worth a shot. 

 

Gonna replace the filter and front/rear seals before install. Anyone have any recommendations for them appreciated, Crown offers replacement parts but honestly scared of them. 

 

Any input on if I need to replace the torque converter or not appreciated?

 

We will see how it goes. 

 

Griff04

[Eagle]

I'm not scared of Crown parts. My Jeep dealer is the local source for them. They use Crown for parts that are no longer available from the factory. Crown is also the only source for a lot of parts for Hudsons (if any of you are old enough the remember Hudson).

[ParadiseMJ]

On ‎8‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 2:37 AM, Griff04 said:

 

 

Gonna replace the filter and front/rear seals before install. Anyone have any recommendations for them appreciated, Crown offers replacement parts but honestly scared of them. 

 

Any input on if I need to replace the torque converter or not appreciated?

 

 

Seals:  I bought new front/rear seals.  Put it all back together, front seal leaked like a mother.  Took it apart again. Looked at the new seal alongside the old seal, completely different.  I should have taken the old seal with me when I bought the new seal.  If you replace the rear seal on the t-case also make sure it is identical to the one you took out.  The NAPA store I bought the rear t=case seal wasn't even close and it also leaked like crazy.

 

Torque converter:  When I swapped the AW4 in, there was no converter included...so I bought a new one with a 2 year warranty...it lasted 11,000 miles...2 years and a week, then it just went "whirrrr" and died.  I had my local tranny shop order me a new one from a torque converter builder with a lifetime warranty that cost me a whole $20 more than the crappy one.  That was a long time (miles wise) ago.  This is a driving truck, it doesn't really go off road much.  I do some trails and a lot of snow and mountain driving, that's about it.

 

FWIW:  The tranny guy said "if it's black, send it back" referring to the brand I bought before.  Also, the only way to test the converter is out of the truck.  There is a special tool and procedure but basically a large screwdriver did the trick.  I asked the tranny guy to test it for me. The converter should turn freely one way and not the other.  If it turned easily both ways it's shot.  You can shake the converter (empty) and it'll rattle a bit, that is NOT and indication of failure.

 

Good luck young fella...LOL  JK

[Strokermjcomanche]

On 8/9/2018 at 10:49 PM, Griff04 said:

 

Yea, that’s a good one, didn’t know you had some “Viking” blood in you lol 

 

A quick question, maybe you can help, I believe I read somewhere that the AW4 had changes made in 91?  Exactly what year(s) would be a plug and play for my 88?

 

thanks

Griff04

You can use up to a 96 /97 aw4 if you want to change the input gear or tcase ... Here is a good thread to read https://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1053970

[Griff04]

Got the donor tranny pulled today, wasn’t too bad. Gonna pull mine tomorrow. Not going to get in a hurry with it. Will prep the donor this week and go with the install next weekend. 

 

Thanks for all the input. 

 

Griff04

[Griff04]

Well I’ve been busy as heck getting ready for bow season and got behind schedule but finally got it all buttoned up. Took it for a drive this afternoon and the donor trans shifted out fine and seems pretty solid...we will just have to see how it holds up. 

 

I do have a couple of questions that maybe someone can help me out with and possibly save me some time in trying to search it out. 

 

1. Does the AW4 have what I’ll call a downshift passing gear? I never really noticed if the original had one or not? If it does maybe its just an adjustment I need to make?  

 

2. I know this is going to sound anal but gear position indicator on the steering wheel column is not in the correct position. When its drive the indicator is showing it in the neutral position. Is there also an adjustment on this also?

 

Thanks in advance. 

Griff04