JeepcoMJ Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 is there anyone on the club that has an AW4 that was behind a 2.5? is the bellhousing a seperate piece on those or is it part of the case? I will need the bellhousing for my cherokee to go behind the 3800 buick motor that's going in it. I'll also need the torque converter for it. reason this is in tech is I want to know the stats/differences between the 2.5 AW4 and the 4.0 AW4. I know jeep made them but there are a very select few equipped like so. also I'd like to buy a complete one or just the bellhousing and torque converter (if the housing is a seperate piece) -Pat p.s. I've considered the 700R4 but no can do. I want the AW4 because I want electronic shifting to set it up witha manual shift automatic (BrettM's kit), so it will be an aw4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjeff87 Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 The bellhousing is seperate, and there is no physical difference between the gearboxes other than that. The 2.5L does require a different torque converter as well. Check with Jerry (tjbliliey)....his MJ is 2.5/AW4 equipped. We helped him convert it to 4WD awhile back, and I remember that much about the trannies. He may have more specific information for you. He reused the 2WD AW4 bellhousing and mated it to a 4WD AW4 from behind a 4.0L. I know he had to order the TC from a place up in Pittsburgh, PA. If you know anyone up near Harry's U-pull in Hazelton, PA, there was a 2.5/AW4 XJ sitting in there.....dunno if it's still there or what's still left on it. I saw it about 1.5 months ago when the wife and I were up in Philly. I didn't have the means to take any parts off it, let alone get them back to VA :( FYI, they come with 4.56's in the axles, stock. Jeff Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeepcoMJ Posted November 15, 2007 Author Share Posted November 15, 2007 any idea what years to look for with this combo? (I hate 4.10's already with the 4 cyl so 4.56 is out of the question...I have to run 3500 RPM to do 65mph right now) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjeff87 Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 only came in 87-89 XJ/MJ's.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeepcoMJ Posted November 15, 2007 Author Share Posted November 15, 2007 oh boy...finding one won't be fun. almost as fun as finding a dakota with 4 cyl and ax15. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldjeep Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 The 2.5 also has a different TCU - the shift points are different. The bellhousing is fairly easy to find, they used an AW4 variant in some isuzus, which is the same bellhousing that was used with the 2.5L cherokees. The TC is really hard to find, but since you are putting it behind a 3.8 there is no reason you couldn't use the 4.0L TC. I've got one in my 2.5L YJ with Bretts shifter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockhardzj Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 I have a few AW4's, one is a 96, the other a 98. the 96 is perfectly fine, the 98 is missing the bell housing, and needs a new oil pump, and torque converter. it also needs the shifter bracket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 I have an '88 2.5L 2WD 4-speed (manual) that I would really like to convert to automatic so my wife can drive it, but I would like to use an AW4 to get the overdrive. I wasn't able to get out to Harry's in pursuit of that one. I have access to a couple of AW4 trannies, what I need is the bell housing. So anyone who can provide specifics regarding other vehicles that would have a bellhousing that works, please post it. I'm sure I am not the only person who would like to hang an AW4 behind a 2.5L. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldjeep Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 88-91 isuzu troopers are the other source for the GM 60 degree bellhousing. It's pretty easy to put the AW4 behind a renix era 2.5L. You will need the bracket that holds the TV cable on the throttle body, and an automatic TPS (It has 2 outputs, one is inverted for the TCU). The more difficult part to find will be the flexplate. Putting it behind a non-renix 2.5 like I did in my 94 YJ is a bigger pain and requires some custom work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjeff87 Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 dang...there's tons of them in the junkyards down here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenosha Warrior Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 patster I acctually yesterday found a 2wd XJ with a 2.5L and an AW-4 The entire rig can be had for $200 I can talk to the guy, Anyone know how much the BH weighs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldjeep Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 patster I acctually yesterday found a 2wd XJ with a 2.5L and an AW-4 The entire rig can be had for $200 I can talk to the guy, Anyone know how much the BH weighs? Maybe 10 lbs, it's just aluminum. Make sure you get the flexplate, throttle body and senseors and TCU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeepcoMJ Posted November 16, 2007 Author Share Posted November 16, 2007 and torque converter. it's useless to me without the torque converter. guys...you can't use the 4.0 TC with that bellhousing...the different TC is because the bellhousing is different. I may build my own bellhousing and use an 4.0 torque converter, then have the buick flexplate redrilled and re(neutrally)ballanced for the 4.0 torque converter. basically, I have plenty of 60 degree bellhousings anyways, and they need to be altered with the starter on the driver's side of the engine rather than the pass. side like the 2.5, so maybe making my own would be smartest. I don't particularly need the TCU as I'd be doing the BRETTM shifter as well, but it would be nice to be able to flip the switch and not have to shift every once in awhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldjeep Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 and torque converter. it's useless to me without the torque converter. guys...you can't use the 4.0 TC with that bellhousing...the different TC is because the bellhousing is different. Pretty sure that the 4.0 TC physically fit in the bellhousing, the major difference is the stall speed. Here's some size specs on the TC's http://www.idatc.com/chrysler/jeep/a340_jeep.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjeff87 Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 yes, the 4L TC fits inside the bell, but the difference is in the front snout that rides inside the flexplate. The 4L one is just a hair longer, and it doesn't seat correctly inside the flexplate. Maybe you could swap flexplates and run one (?), but IIRC the 2.5 BH has a slightly different length, to accomodate the slight difference in size. And I'm sure the stall speed would be different as well (never thought of that, but it makes sense). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeepcoMJ Posted November 16, 2007 Author Share Posted November 16, 2007 hmm. I wonder how I'll make mine work with a 3.8 buick motor then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldjeep Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 hmm. I wonder how I'll make mine work with a 3.8 buick motor then... Same way I made mine work with a MPI 2.5L Get a flexplate that fits your motor and redrill it. I had to use a custom bushing in the crank to get the convertor to seat correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeepcoMJ Posted November 16, 2007 Author Share Posted November 16, 2007 ....ok, screw the auto. not worth the effort, I'll just put an ax5 behind it for now and play nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldjeep Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 ....ok, screw the auto. not worth the effort, I'll just put an ax5 behind it for now and play nice. If you want an auto, why not just use a 200R4 out of an S10? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenosha Warrior Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 ....ok, screw the auto. not worth the effort, I'll just put an ax5 behind it for now and play nice. If you want an auto, why not just use a 200R4 out of an S10? he wants t use BrettM's AW-4 Shifter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeepcoMJ Posted November 16, 2007 Author Share Posted November 16, 2007 exactly. I'm familiar with electronic shifting, not mechanical. so I'd rather work with the system I know. that, and I've already designed my shifter assembly and wire routing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldjeep Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 exactly. I'm familiar with electronic shifting, not mechanical. so I'd rather work with the system I know. that, and I've already designed my shifter assembly and wire routing Ah, figured since you said it wasn't worth the effort that you were giving up on the aw4. Bretts system works pretty well, but make sure you have a really good ground. His microprocessor gets messed up and shifts randomly if there is a lot of noise on the ground. Found that one out the hard way. If I had it to do over again I would have just built my own controller, not much to it - 3 relays and a PIC is about all you need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 You don't really need relays. All you need is a couple or three toggle switches. One of the guys on the old Strokers e-group (Carnuck will remember him) has an AW4 in an old Rambler station wagon. He controls it with a 5 or 6-position rotary switch. Just click-click-click up through the gears, and another click if he wants to lock the converter. Then rotate in the opposite direction for downshifting. I would prefer to be able to run it as an automatic or manual control, but the manual control can be rather rudimentary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldjeep Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 You don't really need relays. All you need is a couple or three toggle switches. One of the guys on the old Strokers e-group (Carnuck will remember him) has an AW4 in an old Rambler station wagon. He controls it with a 5 or 6-position rotary switch. Just click-click-click up through the gears, and another click if he wants to lock the converter. Then rotate in the opposite direction for downshifting. I would prefer to be able to run it as an automatic or manual control, but the manual control can be rather rudimentary. I've seen that setup too, but I prefer the quick up and down shift of 2 momentary buttons on my shift knob. When you use an AW4 with a 2.5L and big tires, manual control on the road is a must. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeepcoMJ Posted November 16, 2007 Author Share Posted November 16, 2007 I'd be setting it up with an arcade style shifter actually. 1,3 2,O with a switch up on the dash to flip it to auto shift, and a button on the end of the shifter for TC lockup. I say brett's kit because you know what it is, I'd do it myself. but...I'm talking about setting this aw4 up to go behind a buick 3800 with a supercharger. the reason that I want one from an aw4 is that they have the same bellhousing with one minor detail...the starter is on the driver's side not the passenger side. so a 4.0 TC is probably closer to the shift points of a 3800 rather than a 2.5. this would be for the 86 cherokee I'm driving...I've basically done all the math to fit a supercharged 3800 in it now, and I want to make a beefier xj twin of my 3800 comanche. auto = offroad preference for me, and the 700r4 or TH904 are in my opinion, crap for what I want Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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