Springs

[jimoshel]

I recently sold Hitman a set of springs from a '95ZJ, 5.2. He's wanting to lift the front of his MJ. When he removed the springs from his MJ he found them to be the same size, length and wire thickness as the one's I sent him. It cost him $40. For that money I, We would like to know whats going on. I'm thinking it might be possible a PO swapped them. Are all the front coil springs on a MJ the same? MT excepted. Any body got any ideas?

405840000.jpg

The coil I removed from a '95 and sent him on the right. A coil from a '89 MJ on the left.

http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL620/13235509/23557276/405840000.jpg

[jimoshel]

 

 

http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL620/13235509/23557276/405840000.jpg

 

 

[HOrnbrod]

Here's an excerpt from the 91-93 parts manual. MJ springs available as follows. But no other specs. I suppose there's a cross-reference somewhere.

 

8                 SPRING, Front
5200 1107 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EF (#655)
5200 1108 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EG (#690)
5200 1109 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EH (#727)
5200 1110 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EJ (#765)
5200 1111 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EK (#806)
5200 1784 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EL
5200 1785 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EM
5200 1786 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EN
5200 1787 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EP
5200 1788 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded ER
5200 1789 AR                  Standard Duty, Coded FL
5200 1114 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FE (#607)
5200 1115 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FF (#646)
5200 1116 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FG (#688)
5200 1117 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FH (#733)
5200 1118 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FJ (#780)
5200 1119 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FK (#831)
5200 1790 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FM
5200 1791 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FN
5200 1792 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FP
5200 1120 AR                  H.D., Coded GD (#578)
5200 1122 AR                  H.D., Coded GF (#670)
5200 1121 AR                  H.D., Coded GE (#622)
5200 1123 AR                  H.D., Coded GG (#720)
5200 1124 AR                  H.D., Coded GH (#775)
5200 1125 AR                  H.D., Coded GJ (#834)
5200 1793 AR                  H.D., Coded GK

[Exgrayxj]

Jim,

 I bought 2 pair of zj coils at the upull, one was an Orvis edition, the other was not otherwise special, both V8 4wd, and both had identical springs.  Both had (apparently factory) poly sway bar links and bushings, got them and a bar also. Most of the zjs didn't have the poly stuff.

The first pair went into my v8 powered xj, and raised it at the front bumper 3" exactly, and were clearly an upgrade when paired next to each other. (XJ v ZJ)

The second pair was for my (as far as I know) stock mj.  1990, 4.0/4wd/AW4/short box.

When I went to swap them I could not get the axle to drop enough without a fight, daylight was running out, so I put it back together.

But while I was wrestling with it, it occurred to me that the springs looked very similar.

As far as I can tell free length is the same. Same number of coils. And if not exactly the same, within a couple thousandths of being the same wire diameter.

I have some other front end work to do, so have put off installing the springs until I am ready to do those also.

 

The ZJ springs I have here have a tag, and the #5208 6362 (?) and code FN on it. Question on the last four digits, could be 8382, or 8362, you get it.

They are as far as I can tell, freestanding, exactly like the one you have on the right.

The short spring you have appears to be even shorter than the spring I took out of the xj, Wagoneer. (Now thrown out).The xj WAS a 4.0/4wd.AW4, now has Chevy v8/700r4.

 

When I ran into the situation on the mj it seemed they were the same, but all I have read is that it is good for a lift, and that 2wd mj used a shorter spring, 4x spring was a lift, and the zj was lift over that.

Not so sure now.

[dave92cherokee]

As I'm sure you know jim and horn free length isn't always a good indication because of the spring rate. The factory xj/mj coils compress a good bit when they're installed because of the lighter load ability, and the v8 zj's lift them a couple of inches due to the heavier curb weight and required handling for that vehicle. Only true way to tell is to take a measurement with the factory one's in his mj then install the zj one's and remeasure the same point.

[Eagle]

Actually, factory ZJ V8 springs generally lift an XJ or MJ exactly one inch. But, as you can see from Hornbrod's list, they are not all the same. In fact, at times Jeep would put different number springs on each side to level out the ride height depending on options in the vehicle.

 

I ordered what is now my wife's 2000 XJ Classic from the factory with the Up Country suspension. That rides 1 inch higher than "stock." Before I had the chassis rustproofed, I crawled under and read the codes off the springs, then I ordered a pair for use in my '87 MJ. When I have the spring number to the guru at the parts department, his immediate response was, 'I though you only had XJs and MJs - why are you buying a pair of ZJ coils?"

 

I subsequently picked up a used 2001 XJ without the Up Country suspension. I bought another pair of the Up Country (ZJ V8) coils) and threw them into that. I measured both sides, before and after the installation. They lifted the front exactly one inch.

[hitman72]

This is the other thing that throw me for a loop and why when jim sent me the dimensions

 

napa 88 mj front coils (the higher coil rate)

http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?R=NCP2775361_0162320305

 

napa 93 grand cherokee front coils.

http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?R=NCP2775360_0162320283

 

 

They are so close together, I don't know.....

 

 

Thanks for help guys.

[Eagle]

This is the other thing that throw me for a loop and why when jim sent me the dimensions

 

napa 88 mj front coils (the higher coil rate)

http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?R=NCP2775361_0162320305

 

napa 93 grand cherokee front coils.

http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?R=NCP2775360_0162320283

 

 

They are so close together, I don't know.....

 

 

Thanks for help guys.

What you're overlooking is that in 1988 they offered high RATE (meaning higher capacity) springs that did not increase the ride height. I made the mistake of ordering my 1988 Cherokee with the optional, heavy-duty (not "off-road") suspension. It rides at the stock height -- 17-1/2" front / 17" rear. But it rides like a ... well, like a truck. And after 25 years and 287,000 miles, including hauling some VERY heavy loads, it hasn't sagged even a fraction of an inch.

 

Those are a different animal from the later model XJ "Up Country" springs, which were part of the off-road package and were intended to increase the ride height by an inch compared to the standard suspension.

[hitman72]

Ok so that answers why on Napa's site there is two sets of springs, one with a higher spring rate then the other but the "loaded ride hight" is still the same? just means that one is a stiffer ride?

[hitman72]

Any idea what these would do?

 

http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?R=RS_RS6423_0191606013

 

 

thanks guys

[Comanche County]

Any idea what these would do?

 

http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?R=RS_RS6423_0191606013

 

 

thanks guys

I ran 3" Rancho coils once upon a time.  They rode hard, had I kept them, I'm sure my tailbone would still be hurting. 

Might as well just go get some old F150 coils from a JY and get the same bone jarring ride and 4" of lift for far less money.

 

Also, 52088363 springs are ZJ V8 UC springs.  They'll give a 4.0 MJ/XJ about 2" of lift maybe a tad more or less depending on vehicle weight and fatigue of the springs.   This is a good read on the UC package, I used it as a guide and put a complete UC package minus the tow hooks on my 5.9 ZJ:  http://www.kevinsoffroad.com/techarticles/zj-upcoupgrade.html 

 

All Orvis models came with the UC package, if an Orvis ZJ has a V8, then it has 52088363 springs. 

 

Like MJ taillights and other MJ specific parts, 52088363 springs are must pulls when I see them in a yard.  You'll be surprised at how many springs still have a readable factory paper tag on them.  If you want UC springs, keep an eye out for Tow Hooks and Skid Plates, they're an indicator that the ZJ is probably a UC model. 

 

Also check here for more P/Us....http://comancheclub.com/topic/26007-ultimate-oem-spring-rates-and-codes-chart/?hl=spring+rates

[hitman72]

Thanks for the info guys.

 

Does anyone make a 2 inch lift coil? I have been looking around and found the only way to get two inches is with pucks, but i would like a little stiffer ride and rather not use pucks. I know i might as well just do 3 inches but don't have the cash for all that goes along with that.

 

thanks

[Bornindesert]

I bought some Old Man Emu springs from Quadratic. They list a basic lift of 2" which I'm combining with ACOS. Supposedly they give good ride, getting close to testing them out over Spring Break.

[hitman72]

I bought some Old Man Emu springs from Quadratic. They list a basic lift of 2" which I'm combining with ACOS. Supposedly they give good ride, getting close to testing them out over Spring Break.

thanks, is there a link you could help me out with?

 

Whats ACOS? haha

[Bornindesert]

www.quadratec.com/

 

That's the site link, you'll have to navigate to the OME springs.

 

ACOS = Adjustable Coil Spacer System made by jKS

 

 

[hitman72]

www.quadratec.com/

 

That's the site link, you'll have to navigate to the OME springs.

 

ACOS = Adjustable Coil Spacer System made by jKS

are these them http://www.quadratec.com/products/16090_4151_07.htm

[Bornindesert]

Yes, those are the exact springs. Not quite 2" but OME also sells a 10mm spacer that gets you an extra .25 inches for a total of 2.

[Bornindesert]

Here they are installed, I'm getting about 2 3/4 inches of lift from the ACOS's plus the 1 3/4 in from the OME springs. I was looking for around 4 1/2 in total lift which is more then enough for the 31's.

[hitman72]

Here they are installed, I'm getting about 2 3/4 inches of lift from the ACOS's plus the 1 3/4 in from the OME springs. I was looking for around 4 1/2 in total lift which is more then enough for the 31's.

damn that is nice. I will be placing the order tomorrow. Should I also order the factory rubber ring that they sit on (forget what they are called) or is that something that i can just get at NAPA?

 

 

thanks

[Bornindesert]

Thanks - My Dana 30 is the xj/mj type front axle for 1988 jeeps and the bottom is metal on metal with a little spring retainer clip the screws into the spring perch. Once you get it apart you'll see the spring perch has a clocked groove to accept the spring. The top does have the rubber insulator and I guess you could replace that if needed. The OME 10mm spacer could slide over the bumps top and seat against the old insulator. I think that's what I'd do unless the spacer instructions said differently

[hitman72]

Sounds good, i think i have everything worked out now. The last thing i need is brake lines, do you recommend any for a three inch rear lift and two inch front?

[hitman72]

Here they are installed, I'm getting about 2 3/4 inches of lift from the ACOS's plus the 1 3/4 in from the OME springs. I was looking for around 4 1/2 in total lift which is more then enough for the 31's.

So i just got my OME coils in the mail...... Were the coils you took out the same length as the OME ones? haha

[hitman72]

Here's an excerpt from the 91-93 parts manual. MJ springs available as follows. But no other specs. I suppose there's a cross-reference somewhere.

 

8                 SPRING, Front

5200 1107 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EF (#655)

5200 1108 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EG (#690)

5200 1109 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EH (#727)

5200 1110 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EJ (#765)

5200 1111 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EK (#806)

5200 1784 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EL

5200 1785 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EM

5200 1786 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EN

5200 1787 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EP

5200 1788 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded ER

5200 1789 AR                  Standard Duty, Coded FL

5200 1114 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FE (#607)

5200 1115 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FF (#646)

5200 1116 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FG (#688)

5200 1117 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FH (#733)

5200 1118 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FJ (#780)

5200 1119 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FK (#831)

5200 1790 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FM

5200 1791 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FN

5200 1792 AR                  Std. Duty, Coded FP

5200 1120 AR                  H.D., Coded GD (#578)

5200 1122 AR                  H.D., Coded GF (#670)

5200 1121 AR                  H.D., Coded GE (#622)

5200 1123 AR                  H.D., Coded GG (#720)

5200 1124 AR                  H.D., Coded GH (#775)

5200 1125 AR                  H.D., Coded GJ (#834)

5200 1793 AR                  H.D., Coded GK

So i dug up the coils i took out of my MJ and the numbers on one of them are as fallows

 

EP

895

200

1787

 

If i deduce this right I have these ones based on your list   5200 1787 AR  MJ              Light Duty, Coded EP,      and they were manufactured in 89.

 

Am i reading this right? thanks guys.

[HOrnbrod]

Yes, that's correct. The "89" prefix to the 8-digit part number is an AMC identifier; doesn't mean 1989. Chrysler dropped the "89" prefix. Most all MJ's except the MT models tons came with light duty front coils.