AMC-MJ Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 The Humvee is proto typed 79'-81' and was sent to uncle sam for testing in 83' 50K units got order and started production in 85' - present. Now giving AM-General was the Commercial/Military division of jeep, AM-General was sold off slightly after/before the Contract for production. So the Humvee and AM-General were under ownership of AMC/Jeep during that time so by technicality wouldn't this make the Mil-spec Humvee and Civilian Hummer an FSJ ? As AM-G produced the 97'/99'+ H1 n 2 for GM sure, but AM-G owned "HUMMER" product line from 92'-97'/99' So why couldn't Chrysler/Jeep have picked up the Hummer line? Just a thought ? ? ? Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 So the Humvee and AM-General were under ownership of AMC/Jeep during that time so by technicality wouldn't this make the Mil-spec Humvee and Civilian Hummer an FSJ ? As AM-G produced the 97'/99'+ H1 n 2 for GM sure, but AM-G owned "HUMMER" product line from 92'-97'/99' I might go along with allowing the original Hummer to be considered an AMC, possibly even a Jeep ... but "FSJ" IMHO refers only to the full-size Cherokee/Wagoneer/Grand Wagoneer vehicles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMC-MJ Posted February 9, 2011 Author Share Posted February 9, 2011 Here is where I get my FSJ thinking of it, The M715 is grouped in with the FSJs. Now Kaiser jeeps General products division is AMC Jeeps AM General division, same people same plant same company different name . . . I also think the AM715 n variants should also be classified in this as well. The Humvee isn't exactly a Mid size or a Compact ya know ;) Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mvusse Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 AMC split off AM General because the US government can not buy military equipment from foreign governments. The French government owned Renault, which n turn owned 40% of AMC. AM General was wholly American owned. I guess a Humvee/Hummer Alpha could be considered a FSJ. The Humvee was built using GM drive trains, and possibly other parts, so when AM General went up for sale, GM was the obvious buyer. GM then went ahead and created the Hummer brand and developed the H2 (based on a modified 3/4 ton Suburban platform) and H3 (based on the Colorado/Canyon platform). An H4 was also planned, based on the tracker platform. And yes, due to their heritage, Hummers do have Jeep grills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeepcoMJ Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 it didn't happen so it doesn't matter. you don't own a time machine do you? if so, let me borrow it to go back and fix some past personal screw-ups prior to you repairing the downfall of AMC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMC-MJ Posted February 9, 2011 Author Share Posted February 9, 2011 AM General history: http://www.amgeneral.com/corporate/history.php No where dose it say GM owned any part of AM General LLC. Here read under "hummer": http://www.amgeneral.com/vehicles/ Due in part to the military HMMWV's success in Desert Storm, AM General introduced a civilian version of the vehicle called the HUMMER in 1992. Known as “the world’s most serious 4x4,” the revolutionary vehicle has found favor with commercial users who appreciated the value of HUMMER’s long life and amazing performance, and individuals who seek the ultimate in toughness and mobility. In 1999, General Motors acquired the HUMMER brand worldwide and rebadged the original vehicle H1. In 2002, AM General began assembling the HUMMER H2 for GM in its new factory in Mishawaka, Ind. This vehicle was designed by and is marketed by General Motors. In 2006, production of the H1 ceased. Although GM acquired the HUMMER brand, they do not own any part of AM General. For specific HUMMER product information visit HUMMER.com. Only thing that WAS GM is the engine/transmission which they now also own the rights too Via GEP or General Engine Products corp & General Transmission Corp, The Humvee and Hummer H1 used aluminum castings of the AMC-20 center section . . . Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpnjim Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 mvusse is right, except for the part about GM buying AM General. The way it was presented on the news, it seemed like they bought AM G, but what GM bought was exclusive rights to sell civilian Hummers, and market the name with their own products (H2 H3, etc). GM then doubled the price (and then some) of the H1, before killing it for lack of sales. :doh: Looks like in the end they just wanted the Hummer name for credibility to market their own products. I don't know if Jeep ever tried to work a deal with AM General for the Hummer name, but I doubt it, since Jeep already has market credibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMC-MJ Posted February 9, 2011 Author Share Posted February 9, 2011 :smart: Credit ! ? ! Lol what dose Jeep need with credibility ? ! ? :dunno: :cheers: By now very one is well aware jeeps are :wrench: cobbled together built with a little of this some of that :wrench: and a lot of whatever :cheers: I just think that Jeep should buy up the Hummer brand rights ect giving Jeep free rein to do as it pleased. A joint venture with AM-General could lead to some amazing products in both the Military and civilian sectors. Increasing the chances of a new Jeep pickup truck for us ;) Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMC-MJ Posted February 9, 2011 Author Share Posted February 9, 2011 AM-General Humvee 79'-Present: Mechanically evolved; AMC-401/AM-TH400/IS AMC-20 (Prototype only) to GM 6.2-NA/TH400/IS AMC-20 to GM6.5-NA/3L80/IS AMC-20 to GM 6.5-T/4L80E/IS AMC-20 to AM-G 6500/AM-G 4L80E/IS AMG-20 to AM-G 6500/AM-G 1200/AMG-20. Structurally evolved: expanded payload/towed loaded Capacities to minor n major body restyling. Technology advances: GPS/Radar/Armor/ect . . . The civilian AM-G Hummer 92'-99'/GM-Hummer 99'-10': Mechanical updates: 6.5-NA/3L80/AM-20 to 6.5-T/4L80E/AM-20 to D-Max/4L85E-Alison/AM-20. Technology/Structural Advances: GM-H2/H3 series added 02'-10'. Sharing common chassie/power train/axles plate forms of product vehicles. What did the FSJ get for updates ? 63'-91': Structurally: Grills n headlights. Roof line alteration: brows n brow less. Mechanically: TH400 to TF727. Kaiser/GM/AMC engines to AM-power. Dana/AMC to Dana/Dana Parts availability and service ability would have to awarded: #1 Humvee. #2 Hummer. #3 FSJ. I guess when broken down, All 3 Rigs differed greatly . . . So not an FSJ ! ? ! ? ! Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpnjim Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 I always considered the Hummer as a wider, (much) more heavy duty version of the M151 MUTTs. Right, or wrong, my unsubstantiated thoughts are: The military decided it's universal 'Jeeps' should be IFS/IRS. They wrote the spec, and Ford built the M151 MUTT (AM General did too). MUTTs started rolling over more than the old solid axle Jeep did (and killing troops). Military they asked for a suspension revision. They still kept rolling over, Military still didn't want to give up on IFS/IRS, so they spec'd a MUTT that's 30" wider. AM General built the best one (HMMWV), and got the contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMC-MJ Posted February 9, 2011 Author Share Posted February 9, 2011 Military still didn't want to give up on IFS/IRS, so they spec'd a MUTT that's 30" wider. AM General built the best one (HMMWV), and got the contract. You must have ESP ? ! ? ! ? 1979 American Motors General "Humvee" prototype: The 79'-81' Prototype's were powered by a heavy duty version of AMC's 401 V8 engine, Turbo hydromatic 400 transmission, Spicer transfer case, and was equipped the all new independent suspension Model 20 which were made from case aluminum. The powerful but inefficient AMC V8 wasn't producing enough vehicle range to meet military specifications. The vehicle had some stability concerns. vehicle was expanded into the "Humvee" we know to this day. AM General decided to power this new "humvee" with the all new GM-6.2L diesel engine. This Vehicle was sent to the US Armed forces for testing and evaluation, A contract was signed for 55,000 units by 1985 AM General rolled the first of many humvees off the assembly line. First production Humvee 1985: Yep you total must have been reading through my eyes ! Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knever3 Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Still in my eyes nothing will touch a Hummer H1 Alpha. Can you imagine the possiblities of tuning that?!! How about 500hp and 900+ft/lbs of torque and that kind of off road capability. I would love to get my hands on one screw the gas mileage. The other Hummers don't hold a candle to the H1, they are just marketing at it's best. I love that 2 door H1 on Gone in 60 Seconds. But my choice would be the Huge one with the full top if they made it in the H1 Alpha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMC-MJ Posted February 11, 2011 Author Share Posted February 11, 2011 500hp / 900tq from the H1 alpha sure its a Duramax ! 325hp/550tq is a fully built 6.5-Truck engine. 450hp/600tq is a fully built 6.5-Marine engine. Any 6.5 in a truck pushed to 275+ HP has over heating issues and tends to shatter crabk shafts . . . The unlimited cooling of the Marine engines allow for increased power but shortened reliability . . . Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbunch Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 I agree with "jpnjim" The Humvee is just the military Jeep we know and love evolved through the years. Next incarnation will probably be built by the guys at Howe & Howe fab shop. Since no one else makes kick @$$ stuff anymore! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMC-MJ Posted February 11, 2011 Author Share Posted February 11, 2011 Never fear Hummer is gone, But AM General and the Humvee is still here: http://www.amgeneral.com/ Humvee pickup: Humvee SUV: Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMC-MJ Posted February 11, 2011 Author Share Posted February 11, 2011 :bowdown: AM General and General Tactical Vehicle have Joined up on a joint venture on these Rigs :wrench: Over built "pickup" and an "SUT" Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 The Humvee isn't exactly a Mid size or a Compact ya know ;) It isn't exactly a Jeep, either. You asked ... I do not consider a Humvee to be a FSJ. Personally, I don't even consider it to be a Jeep. I consider a Humvee to be a Humvee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMC-MJ Posted February 11, 2011 Author Share Posted February 11, 2011 It isn't exactly a Jeep, either.You asked ... I do not consider a Humvee to be a FSJ. Personally, I don't even consider it to be a Jeep. I consider a Humvee to be a Humvee. " Post subject: Re: Humvee/Hummer an FSJ ? decendant ? ? " Funny I don't see where I asked you ? ! ? . . . Must have missed that ? ? ? . . . I'm sure you'll point it out tho ;) ! Now I don't really see it being an FSJ or a relative to any jeeps its more or less a larger better version of the M151 MUTT . . . Jeeps tend to be cobbled together out what ever is laying around at the time of assembly, the humvee seems to be rather organized and professional. I guess the professionalism of its design and assembly is what makes it vastly superior to most Jeeps. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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