Power Steering Pulley Wheel 1987 MJ 2.5L - 5300 3805

[NickyV]

Sorry to post a new thread on this so  soon , but I wanted to try to get a conversation going about the power steering pulley wheel on late-80s Comanches with 2.5L engines.

 

My issue is minor but annoying. The power steering pump works, but it makes noise, specifically a clicking noise.

 

I did a bunch of reading last night — including of old parts manuals. It seems like the 1987-1990 and possibly 1991 MJ, XJ and SJ’s with the 2.5L and power steering, came with a pulley wheel that is hard to find these days. The part number is 5300 3805 for those who are interested.

 

I have some questions about this, and if we can answer them all in one thread, it could be really helpful to anyone troubleshooting their power steering on an ‘87-‘90 (and maybe ‘91) MJ, or other similar jeep with a 2.5L + power steering.

 

QUESTIONS:

 

1) Does anyone know why other similar pulleys cause issues on the ‘87 and other adjacent years with the 2.5L? And before you answer, I understand that they don’t line up quite right. But does anyone have details or theories about how/why they don’t line up? Are they too far forward? Too far back? Is the angle off? Are the ribs on the pulley not quite right? All of the above?

 

2) If someone like me can’t find the exact OEM part or parts, has anyone had luck with making other parts fit? What did you do? Did you put spacers behind the bracket, for example?

 

3) In my case specifically, the pulley wheel I am currently using is marked G3 53002909. I think it came off a YJ, but maybe something else… with this particular pulley wheel, is there something I can do to fix my issue (which is a clicking sound)?

 

DETAILS & PICS:

- Pump Style: I have this style of pump. It’s the kind with a remote reservoir.

 

- Belt Position on Pulley: Here is how the belt sits on the pulley. I tried scooting the wheel forward on the wheel, but it didn’t make a difference. Probably because the grooves hold it in place.

 

 

- Rough Grooves: I was originally thinking that the rough spots on my pulley wheel’s grooves were playing a part in this. And maybe they are. I tried my best to file/sand them smooth.

 

Before: 

 

 

After:

 

 

 

[eaglescout526]

AC or no AC?

 

If no, post a pic of the alt pulley. 
 

Also fun fact, you can put in a 4.0L pump and reservoir assembly if you want to do away with the remote reservoir. 
 

Possibility for your alignment/issue could solely be based on the alt pulley. A specific pulley is used on the alt for models without AC that push the belt outward to align the rest of them. The alt sinks back in vs than with an AC compressor. Why? I have no idea why AMC did it like this but it worked for them. 
 

2. See my fun fact. 
 

3. Didn’t think the YJ would have such a different pulley but you could always compare the two. 

[NickyV]

Hey @eaglescout526! I thought I might hear from you. Still no AC. One of these days, I swear… I’ve got most of the components now.

 

I’m attaching a pic of my alternator pulley. Belt is off currently because I wanted to get a good look at my PS pulley.

 

 

[eaglescout526]

Huh. Interesting. You do have the right pulley for the alt. 
 

Now we are on to something here about the power steering. Might be something we are gonna have to look out for. I’ll snap a pic of my power steering in the morning. Maybe the pulley isn’t pressed on far enough

[GonzoTheGreat]

When does it click? Always, or just when turning? Are you 100% sure the sound is coming from the pump? A mechanic's stethoscope can help, if there's any doubt.

[NickyV]

OK… before I go any further. @eaglescout526, are you saying that the issue with these pulley wheels is that it is difficult to press them on far enough? Because based on the way my belt was sitting, I thought I had originally pressed it on too far. So I started backing the pulley wheel off a bit. I did not try going deeper, and I could have gone a bit deeper.
 

Also, @eaglescout526 Thanks, and please do show me what you have.

@GonzoTheGreat I do need to get a stethoscope. Keep forgetting to do that. But I am 95% sure it has to do with the power steering.

 

It clicks when it is simply running. I don’t think turning makes much of a difference. But the clicks get more rapid with acceleration. Honestly, it’s like the pulley wheel isn’t quite true or something. Like every rotation there is one spot that catches a little bit.

 

THINGS I STILL NEED TO TRY:

 

1) Use stethoscope. And/or remove PS entirely, reconnect old flywheel. See if sound persists.

2) Try new belt.

 

I should be able to do 1 & 2 this weekend.

 

3) See if I can get exact part for PS pulley wheel.

 

3.5) If I can’t get exact part, source a cleaner pulley wheel smoother grooves. Or… do a better job smoothing it out.

 

Not sure when I can get to these steps.

 

QUESTIONS I STILL HAVE FOR COMMUNITY:

 

A) What is it about the exact power steering pulley wheel part that makes it so critical or at least desirable in the 2.5L engines from the late 80s?

 

B) Eagle Scout noted that there is a specific alternator pulley wheel for 2.5L without AC. He said it “sinks in.” I take it that means toward the cab? If that’s the case, I may have made a mistake when adjusting the pulley wheel, because I was worried it was already too far back.

P.S. - Sorry, as always, for the super long posts. :-/

[eaglescout526]

6 minutes ago, NickyV said:

B) Eagle Scout noted that there is a specific alternator pulley wheel for 2.5L without AC. He said it “sinks in.” I take it that means toward the cab? If that’s the case, I may have made a mistake when adjusting the pulley wheel, because I was worried it was already too far back.

Ill get you a pic later. Forgot this morning. 
 

As for B, what I’m saying is is the alt bracket for setups without AC sinks the alt further in so towards the firewall, opposed the AC setups where the alt moves toward the radiator and uses a more standard pulley. That’s why your alt has that weird extra groove on it. 
 

I’ll also look in my parts manual and see what’s goin on there. I can’t see it being to specific unless it’s a size thing. I’ve seen on 86’s have a different pulley for the Saginaw pump. 
 

But what you need to do is just get the belt in line. Otherwise you’ll end up destroying belts. 

[NickyV]

That’s great, @eaglescout526! Exactly the kind of thing I was looking for. I did NOT realize the alternator pulley has an extra groove. Maybe it’s not critical, but that helps me picture what might be going on.

 

I’m looking forward to seeing your alt pulley so I can compare.

[eaglescout526]

I installed AC in mine a few years ago so pics won’t help. 
 

HOWEVER!  I can say when I didn’t have AC that the alt had the AC style pulley on vs the no AC pulley. It did in fact throw the belt alignment off. Not enough to do any damage or anything like that. But it was noticeable when looking at the belt from the power steering down to the alt. 

[NickyV]

I ran the power steering the way it was -- with the clicking -- for about a year. I think the most I've driven the truck in one sitting is about 50 miles at a time. I've probably put 500 miles on it or so. I don't know if that's enough to destroy a belt that's catastrophically misaligned, but I would think so.

 

What I'm saying is that I don't think it is terribly, terribly misaligned. But this is the path I've been chasing to resolve the click.

 

You know... with everything I've learned so far about this truck, I wouldn't be surprised if the culprit ended up being something else or something bone simple. But it's all interesting!

 

It's a journey, you know?

[eaglescout526]

Oh yeah. Each Jeep is it’s own journey to getting it roadworthy and like it was from the factory. 
 

Are you sure that the clicking isn’t something internal to the pump? Or something else? I can’t imagine a pulley doing this but stranger things. 
 

Is the clicking rhythmic or is it just a random click?

[Eagle_SX4]

If you want to isolate the pump you could take take the belt off. Then having the belt only around the power steering pump, use a hand drill with the belt around the chuck to drive the pump by itself with the engine off to check the pump itself. It would be a little precarious but should work.

[NickyV]

That’s an interesting suggestion, @Eagle_SX4! I might give that a try this evening. Although, I don’t think I’d be able to replicate the tension…
 

@eaglescout526, I just changed the pump last weekend. Pump is brand new, pulley wheel is the same and belt is a year old. The clicking is kind of rhythmic. It happens at regular intervals.

 

I need to do some more process of elimination for sure.

[eaglescout526]

Ok has the clicking been around with the old pump too?

[watchamakalit]

If you don't have a stethoscope a piece of vacuum hose stuck in one ear works well also. 

[NickyV]

15 hours ago, eaglescout526 said:

Ok has the clicking been around with the old pump too?

 

Yes. The clicking was around on the old pump, too. I have a few updates after working on the truck last night:

 

TL;DR: I think this is due to a combination of factors. Those are: A beat up pulley wheel. A belt that has suffered as a result of a beat-up and poorly adjusted pulley wheel. Engine compartment temperature. I am less sure now that getting the exact right part will make a difference, but I'm still on the hunt for the OEM part.

 

Some Clarification: I keep calling this a "click." But that's it's hard to find the right words. It's definitely not a "squeal." It's not a "groan" or a "sigh." But it honestly might be a "chirp," rather than a "click."  

 

The Good News: Whatever we call this noise, I think I have succeeded in getting it so it doesn't make the noise when idling. However...

 

The Neutral News: When I started it up this morning, it was making noise again... until it got warm under the hood. Then it went back to being quiet. So I think temperature is playing a role here.

 

The "Meh" News: Once I get to about 20 on the tachometer, I start to hear belt noise again. This is with the truck in neutral. I'll drive it around this weekend and try to see what it sounds like under load.

 

My Procedure: This might be obvious to the more experienced folks out there. But if you come across this thread, here's what worked for me. I still do not have a belt tension measuring tool (but I'm going to get one), and I definitely don't have a fancy laser guided pulley wheel alignment tool. I discovered that the puller/pusher I rented could fit on the pump without removing it. I used the OEM Tools Pulley Puller/Installer from AutoZone.

1. I loosened the back two bolts and the top pivot-bolt — keeping them just barely loose enough so that the tensioner could be adjusted.
2. I started with the pulley as far back toward the pump/firewall as I felt comfortable (there was maybe a quarter inch or less of the pump's shaft visible between the pump and the back side of the pulley).
3. I'd fire it up, see what it sounded like, and mess with the tension a bit — either tighter or looser. Then I'd shut it off and scoot the pulley wheel forward in tiny increments until I finally got to a spot where it wasn't making the offending noise when idling.

What I'll Try Next: I was thinking about trying a deep clean of the belt and pulleys and some belt conditioner spray. But I might just deep clean the pulleys and get a brand new belt and then hit it with some belt conditioner.

 

8 hours ago, watchamakalit said:

If you don't have a stethoscope a piece of vacuum hose stuck in one ear works well also. 

 

Thanks for the tip. That makes sense!