redwolf624

i did, looks closed off like a tube bumper or somethin unless the plastic dirt skirt is in the way :dunno: can't see a way to take that bumper off either :( and if lights are aimed right they can be used for anything with the right modification, just throwin my 2 cent out there :D Redwolf No, they can't. Because the lenses are different, and the reflectors are different, so the lights throw light in a completely different pattern. Aiming driving lights low enough to not blind on-coming drivers would make them useless as driving lights, and because the beam is very narrow they would also be useless as fog lights. And the fact remains, however you aim them they ARE driving lights, and the law for driving lights is that they can operate ONLY with the high beams ... while the law for fog lights is that they canNOT operate with the high beams. Skidoo's excellent wiring diagram is NOT correct for driving lights. It can be modified to work for driving lights, but as drawn it is WRONG if your lights are driving lights. And, by the way, just putting a yellow lens on a driving light doesn't make it a fog light. technically that's how it should be by law but the inspectors around here are so stupid i could slap neon green show lights on my bumper, wire it in and tell the inspector they're fog lights and they'll believe it, Redwolf . FYI - I have been pulled over twice in Florida and once in Alabama by highway patrolmen who first raged at me for my lights, then ran me through a test on the side of the road to see if they were properly wired according to the law. As a matter of fact, they were not - but I got away with it all 3 times by switching the lights using both hands (one to switch the hi-lo beams, the other on the driving lights switch) manually on their command. I am not sure they actually knew the law exactly, but they were sure some kinda mad at me (though they did let me go without a ticket all 3 times). . Moral of the story - don't be a dumbass (like I was when I was young) and use annoyingly and hazardously bright lights in town, and make sure to wire up your lights to be legal. oh i know, today i'm goin down to the only state inspector i go to now, since he knew my truck had neutral safety switch when it was built, and askin him bout the fog light drivin light thing, if indeed the state of virginia requires drivin lights only to be wired to turn on with hi beams then i'm takin em back to walmart and goin on another holly quest for fog lights that are water prove, Redwolf

i did, looks closed off like a tube bumper or somethin unless the plastic dirt skirt is in the way :dunno: can't see a way to take that bumper off either :( and if lights are aimed right they can be used for anything with the right modification, just throwin my 2 cent out there :D Redwolf No, they can't. Because the lenses are different, and the reflectors are different, so the lights throw light in a completely different pattern. Aiming driving lights low enough to not blind on-coming drivers would make them useless as driving lights, and because the beam is very narrow they would also be useless as fog lights. And the fact remains, however you aim them they ARE driving lights, and the law for driving lights is that they can operate ONLY with the high beams ... while the law for fog lights is that they canNOT operate with the high beams. Skidoo's excellent wiring diagram is NOT correct for driving lights. It can be modified to work for driving lights, but as drawn it is WRONG if your lights are driving lights. And, by the way, just putting a yellow lens on a driving light doesn't make it a fog light. technically that's how it should be by law but the inspectors around here are so stupid i could slap neon green show lights on my bumper, wire it in and tell the inspector they're fog lights and they'll believe it, Redwolf

Yes, this would be a good thing for you to do. Couple of tips: 1. There should be two holes in the top face of the bumper maybe covered with plastic plugs. These holes are normally used to mount the lamps if you purchased the low profile rectangular lights normally used on MJ/XJ vehicles. Jeep originally used Marchal halogen lamps. 2. If you remove the bottom two bumper mounting mounting bolts, this will allow you to pivot the bumper up a couple of inches and give you more room to attach the lamp mounting hardware behind the bumper. bottom 2 bolts that are star flange bolts right on the bumper? Redwolf

Driving lights cast a narrow long-distance beam (farther than high-beams do) and are quite different from fog lights, which cast a wide, shallow, flat beam (good for shining under fog to reduce glare). For that reason, FMVSS law requires driving lights to be wired to come on only with the high beams. For the driving I generally do, I prefer driving lights so I can see deer well off in the distance, so I use driving lights (YMMV). . With regard to mounting - I guess the hardest bit would be the wiring, so removing the bumper would give you additional space to work. I am lazy that way and will accept a certain amount of skinned knuckles to get the job done the harder way if I think it is faster.... but man! why don't you stick your nose under the bumper and figure it out? :D i did, looks closed off like a tube bumper or somethin unless the plastic dirt skirt is in the way :dunno: can't see a way to take that bumper off either :( and if lights are aimed right they can be used for anything with the right modification, just throwin my 2 cent out there :D Redwolf

got a question, finally gonna get around to mountin my "fog lights" i ended up buyin drivin lights that i'll eventually put orange or yellow lenses on, but how to i mount em to the bumper, do i have to take the bumper off or is there an easier way? Redwolf

Almost all of them today have plastic housings. Plastic doesn't rust. yeah but ya shoulda seen how poor this plastic was, plus plastic lenses suit me better :) Redwolf

might have to just modify that by drillin 6 holes, three on each side :) deffently worth tryin! Redwolf

IIRC, with the factory harness the fogs ONLY operate when the headlights are on. Not with just the parking lights, and definitely not by themselves with no other lights on. The wiring diagram posted by Skidoo allows the use of the fogs only, even if no other lights are on. My alternate suggestion would still require the use of the parking lights. IMHO the factory wiring was a dumb setup for that reason. I don't know why they did it that way, as I had owned AMC cars in the early 80s that had factory fog that did NOT require the headlights to be on, yet still went off when the high beams came on. Redwolf ... just use Ski's wiring diagram. EXACTLY as he posted it. Just remember that the relays will both have five terminals, and pay attention to which one uses terminal 87 and which one uses terminal 87A. gotcha, bought fog lights yesterday from advance, they didn't come with a relay but it had all the wires and a huse :dunno: :???: took em back though cause i didn't like how the housin was plastic and the lense was glass, Redwolf

alright thanks folks, i got it now :thumbsup: Redwolf

factory bumpers are easy to find, i know of 2 MJs in the yards with the rear bumber still the stock one :) i just don't know how mucht the yard sells em for since i hardly go to that yard, Redwolf Easy to find? You're smoking something. Factory rear bumper that isn't all rusted out, bent up, or missing end caps are one of the harder parts to find. Right up there with tail lights. I've owned four MJs and stripped just about every one in a junk yard in this state, and only my current one has had a factory rear bumper. It's bent up and missing an end cap though. Since you seem to have a lucky scrap yard, any chance you'd be willing to grab me one and ship it? Needs to have all the parts though (minus brackets) and not be bent up or rusted through anywhere. Chrome would be a plus to keep it matching my front and all the other chrome, but not a huge deal just to get an unbent factory bumper. I keep asking people that question that come across them in yards and post pics of the trucks they find with them, but I never get an answer. well i'm goin out to those yards saturday cause i'm lookin for a piece for my bumper, i know one had NO rust but i don't know if it was bent or not, i'll take another look at it and if it don't i'll see what i can pull :) Redwolf

that's how i wanna wire it in, so modifin the wirin diagram skiddo shared to us what on the diagram would be different to make it like that? Redwolf

PLEASE! Start a new discussion when you start talking about a new problem. It doesn't help you and it gets very confusing to have two completely unrelated discussions going on in the same thread. THIS thread is about radios ... sorry eagle, the pm button didn't work when i posted it, i did it from the phone, Redwolf

thanks for the diagram, that'll be very useful, only question right now is, where are the relays located, on the fuse box or inside the dash? Redwolf They aren't "located." You provide them, and you put them anywhere you want them. Your new lights may come with one relay, but to make the lights go off when the headlights are on high beam (which is required by law, so it's not a bad idea) you need the two relays in series, as drawn in that very excellent wiring diagram. The onlyy thing I would do differently would be the power tap to the toggle switch. Where Skidoo shows the white wire going to the ignition, I would tap it of one of the parking lights. That way, the fogs won't work unless you have at least the parking lights turned on. But -- that's a matter of preference. It'll work just fine as drawn -- provided you know how to find a circuit to tap that's controlled by the ignition switch. Also, pay close attention to the relay terminal markings. Skidoo shows only four terminals, but the relays have five. On one of them you use terminal 87, on the other you use terminal 87a. This is important. noted eagle thanks, and like ya said, tappin it into the parkin lights is preference, i like to select all my stuff, fog light or just parkin lights, Redwolf

to be honest i haven't traced it yet, i'm waitin till i buy new fog lights untill i trace em, Redwolf

ok, if my truck has fog lights where would the relay be if the previous owner had em installed right? Redwolf

i'm not in NC but if it's north enough in NC like moyock of somethin close to that i could make it, Redwolf

factory bumpers are easy to find, i know of 2 MJs in the yards with the rear bumber still the stock one :) i just don't know how mucht the yard sells em for since i hardly go to that yard, Redwolf

thanks for the diagram, that'll be very useful, only question right now is, where are the relays located, on the fuse box or inside the dash? Redwolf

how would that be done, is there a fuse slot in the fuse box that'll shut em off when the high beams are on, Redwolf

i'm buyin new fog lights tomorrow since i tested my current ones and they don't even light up when hooks up to a power supply and yes i made sure everything is good, but anyhow, is there a way to hook the fog lights up to where once the high beams are turned on the fog lights shut off? i never saw a "switch" on my light switch for fog lights, just tryin to get everything right :) Redwolf

i'm still havin the same problem, i'm gonna try replacin the antenna cable hopefully this weekend, i'll let ya know if that solves the problem since i changed radios and i still have the issue, also, how'd ya fix the lights to get em to turn on when the doors open, i've yet to get that fixed, Redwolf

agreed, i'm also seein more and more MJs in my area with no hitches, maybe if enough of us do get a hitch company to make em again they'll keep em on the market again :dunno: Redwolf

Hypothetically thinking, figure an unpainted unit that'd be shipped right to your door. If there was to be a short run produced what would an acceptable price be? like i said, an acceptable price for me would be no more than 350, i could build one for less than that but the 350 i'm figurin labor, materials, workers gotta get paid so, Redwolf

$400 for a hitch, even by reese that's too much, i'd go trough the trouble of makin my own for that price, $250 yeah, $350, maybe, Redwolf

if we can get resse on some other hitch company to make a trailer hitch for the MJ, i'd be all for that, Redwolf