drewyoungblood Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 I've got my grandpas 86. Put big ton springs and new shocks on. Need someone who really knows there stuff to walk me through what axle and wheels I need to put on to increase payload from stock. 2 wheel drive long bed. Bed is toast and if I can't find a solid donor I'll be interested in adding duals and a flatbed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted July 5, 2014 Share Posted July 5, 2014 ??? With metric ton springs the payload is 2200 pounds. Of course, the Dana 35 axle may not stand up to that too long. You need either an XJ or MJ Dana 44, an MJ AMC Model 20, or a 97 or newer Chrysler 8-1/4 out of an XJ. The Chrysler axle would be my last choice because of the puny 9" brakes, but it's also probably the easiest to find. I don't think you should even consider bumping the payload over 2200 pounds. The frame won't be happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drewyoungblood Posted July 5, 2014 Author Share Posted July 5, 2014 So I thought a 44 would be my only option. So before I changed the springs I couldn't put a big truck tire in the bed. You are basically saying putting duals on would rucking betarded because the frame won't handle it. So first I need to find the axle. Will a of these work with my existing drive train? I'd like to be able to haul 1500 or a small gooseneck trailer without having to do much more than axle and bigger wheels if I can. What else will I need? Where can I find the right parts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimoshel Posted July 6, 2014 Share Posted July 6, 2014 Why not do it right and get a bigger truck to start with? The used truck ads are full of 3/4 and 1 ton trucks. :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drewyoungblood Posted July 6, 2014 Author Share Posted July 6, 2014 Because there isn't anything wrong with this one and I can do what I need with this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeep Driver Posted July 6, 2014 Share Posted July 6, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnj92131 Posted July 6, 2014 Share Posted July 6, 2014 I've got my grandpas 86. Put big ton springs and new shocks on. Need someone who really knows there stuff to walk me through what axle and wheels I need to put on to increase payload from stock. 2 wheel drive long bed. Bed is toast and if I can't find a solid donor I'll be interested in adding duals and a flatbed. Your 1986 truck had a max payload weight of 1000 kg (2240 lbs) or so, WHEN PROPERLY equipped from the factory. Some, but not all of the equipment would be an automatic transmission, a factory heavy duty cooling system, v6 engine, AMC 20 rear axle, a specific ratio, power steering and brakes. There is more I am sure. Your truck also would have a MAX GVW rating that also caps you payload. A dual axle will not up your factory payload rating, rather will reduce your payload because it is heavier than the stoc AMC 20 axel. Also if you want to tow more than 1000 lbs, the factory says you need a frame mounted receiver and an equalizing hitch. PLUS all the H.D. stuff listed above. And the MAX tow rating for the 86 is 3500 lbs WHEN properly equipped. If you need to move more than that, as Jim said, get a 3/4 ton full lize pick up. Now, people will tell you they towed/carried way above those limits with none of the "required" equipment. Lots of times. Yes, they have. But this is what the factory says is required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drewyoungblood Posted July 6, 2014 Author Share Posted July 6, 2014 Well I have part of the daytime package but I don't know how to tell what axle I have. It is an automatic. I don't know if I have been anything but I doubt I do. I guess it's a good thing I have all new coolant lines. If I put a flatbed on I will have a Gooseneck hitch on it. Seems to me like maybe all that I really need is the appropriate axle and possibly new gears. As well as appropriate weight rated tires. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drewyoungblood Posted July 6, 2014 Author Share Posted July 6, 2014 Yeah so not all of that makes sense. It was dark and I had to use dictation because my hands were dirty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted July 6, 2014 Share Posted July 6, 2014 So I thought a 44 would be my only option. So before I changed the springs I couldn't put a big truck tire in the bed. You are basically saying putting duals on would rucking betarded because the frame won't handle it. So first I need to find the axle. Will a of these work with my existing drive train? I'd like to be able to haul 1500 or a small gooseneck trailer without having to do much more than axle and bigger wheels if I can. What else will I need? Where can I find the right parts? So I thought a 44 would be my only option. So before I changed the springs I couldn't put a big truck tire in the bed. You are basically saying putting duals on would rucking betarded because the frame won't handle it. So first I need to find the axle. Will a of these work with my existing drive train? I'd like to be able to haul 1500 or a small gooseneck trailer without having to do much more than axle and bigger wheels if I can. What else will I need? Where can I find the right parts? As I and others have pointed out, a Comanche with Metric Ton springs has a payload of 2200 pounds with no need for special wheels or tires, so that takes care of your 1500 wish list.. Use standard Jeep wheels, go to Wal-Mart, and get a set of the original Wrangler Radials for $88 per tire. The ony size available these days is 235R75-15, which is one size larger than the largest tire offered from the factory but which is (IMH) a perfect tire size for a street XJ or MJ. No upgrades to the frame are necessary. As others have pointed out, to tow a heavy trailer you do need heavy-duty cooling and you should have a heavy-duty axle. In the days of the XJ and MJ, the oprional heavy-duty axle was the AMC Model 20 in 1986, and the Dana 44 after that. The '97 and newer Chrysler 8-1/4 is just about equal to the Dana 44 in strength, so that's also a possibility. First, you need to know what axle you have. Post a photo of the rear differential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incommando Posted July 6, 2014 Share Posted July 6, 2014 There is a large misconception about payload as it relates to Gross Vehicle Weight Rating ( GVWR). The MJ is a very light weight truck. You can add 2,000 pounds to the bed and still have the total vehicle weight respectably low. A 2wd MJ weighs approximatelly 2,900 pounds while a 2wd 1086 C10 weighed right at 4,000 #'s using a rear axle equal to a D44 and p-metric tires. So you can add an additional 1,100 #'s to an MJ and it will just be equaling the wieght of an unladen 1/2-ton fullsize truck! An MJ with 2,000 in the bed and a stock 1/2 ton axle like a D44, 8.8, or even 8.25 puts no more pressure on a tire than the average 1/2 ton (10,15,1500,150,100, whatever) truck with less then half of that cargo weight. The 1/2 trucks of that era also used D44 & similar axles. P-metric tires are no doubt still within their ratings at those forces. Consider that the average 1/2 ton truck is loosely designed around hauling 1/2 ton (1,000) and a 1-ton truck of that era was designed around hauling 1 ton (2000) then there is probably no need to upgrade the MJ any as it is already an over-achiever. Modern trucks actually far exceed the hauling and towing capacities of MJ era trucks but that also has to do with braking systems and other factors. Granted I am not very familiar with the early MJ's other than they are noted for being very under powered. But a 4.0L truck with a decent rear axle, metric ton springs, and properly working brakes and suspension can handle towing 5,000 #'s and hauling up to 2,200 pounds in stock form. Loaded it would be equal in weight to a C10 carrying 1,000#'s. If you need more capacity then that you are looking at the wrong truck to start with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drewyoungblood Posted July 6, 2014 Author Share Posted July 6, 2014 I can't figure how to post a picture on my phone but my wife texted me pictures. I matched it up to a chart I found online. I've got a old Dana 35, new metric ton springs, new ranch shocks, new tiny little tires I found for 80 without giving a dime to walmart, automatic transmission. So from what you guys are saying is if I get a Dana 44 I should be able to haul 2200? Will my drive shaft work with that? Where is the best place to get a Dana 44 fir this truck? Are they all the same? I just assumed the tiny tires would be safer being replaced with a tire with a few more ply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted July 6, 2014 Share Posted July 6, 2014 I just assumed the tiny tires would be safer being replaced with a tire with a few more ply. "Tiny" doesn't tell us anything. What size are they, and what load range are they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drewyoungblood Posted July 6, 2014 Author Share Posted July 6, 2014 I'll handle tires once I get the axle done I think. I'm not at home to see the truck tire size but I know what was stock wasn't available so I had to get the next closest size? I know I could find a donor or junkyard axle and I know the three types I can put on now. What id like to know is a good place to start looking for a rebuilt one of the three that will work with the drive shaft I've got. I'd like to buy something I can just bolt on if possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc Posted July 6, 2014 Share Posted July 6, 2014 Unless you find an MJ D44 or AMC 20 (which will be bolt in) the rest will not bolt in. I have the Chrysler 8.25 with metric ton springs under my 86 long box, beautiful combo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 What id like to know is a good place to start looking for a rebuilt one of the three that will work with the drive shaft I've got. I'd like to buy something I can just bolt on if possible. Sorry -- not possible. First, unless you get VERY lucky and find a Comanche in a junkyard with a heavy-duty axle, more than likely you'll be getting an axle from a Cherokee. The Comanche is spring under axle (SUA) and the Cherokee is spring over axle (SOA). Also, the distance apart for the spring perches is slightly different for the Cherokee. So there's basically no way to avoid welding spring perches (unless you luck into a Comanche Dana 44). Second, both the Dana 44 and the Chrysler 8-1/4 are about 1-inch longer than the Dana 35, so to use either (at stock height) you will probably have to get the driveshaft shortened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incommando Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 If changing axles and rigging a gooseneck or 5th wheel hitch are no big deal a drive shaft shortening should be no bigge. Go to a junkyard and pickup a donor shaft that uses the same single 297 joint at each end. Have it shortened to length per a chart located on here somewhere. Do it ahead of time and it won't delay you at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeep Driver Posted July 7, 2014 Share Posted July 7, 2014 What id like to know is a good place to start looking for a rebuilt one of the three that will work with the drive shaft I've got. I'd like to buy something I can just bolt on if possible. Sorry -- not possible. First, unless you get VERY lucky and find a Comanche in a junkyard with a heavy-duty axle, more than likely you'll be getting an axle from a Cherokee. The Comanche is spring under axle (SUA) and the Cherokee is spring over axle (SOA). Also, the distance apart for the spring perches is slightly different for the Cherokee. So there's basically no way to avoid welding spring perches (unless you luck into a Comanche Dana 44). Second, both the Dana 44 and the Chrysler 8-1/4 are about 1-inch longer than the Dana 35, so to use either (at stock height) you will probably have to get the driveshaft shortened. Working on mine, currently. Image Not Found Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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