Going Rate For Full Width Axles?

[87Warrior]

I have been debating on a different build direction for my rusty MJ. Full width and big tires. So I have been researching axles.

 

What types of prices are you guys finding for a set of axles, front and rear? D44, D60, 14 bolt, etc?

 

Saw a hub to hub D44 HP and 60 with disks and 4.56's on CL this evening. Price seems to be on target for those particular axles. Pair from the same truck is nice too.

[mountainman]

There are some good deals to be had on your local/semi local CL for previously built stuff that someone is selling, IF thats the route your after.

If you wanna do work, you can get axles out of junk yards CHEAP.

At my local picApart any axle is 137 bucks. So i could go get tons tmrw and be stoked. BUT of course then have to clean em and prep em to go under my truck and redo gears and add lockers and axles or whatever i thought i may need.

That would be my way cause my labor is free and when i hit the trail thats hard enough to require those axles on my truck, i want to know EVERY part inside them is new.

 

If your goin beast status.. do a 14 bolt and 60 front. cut them fenders out and put some 42s! :D

[mvusse]

A while ago I could have had a balljoint high pinion 60 with 4.10 gears and matching Sterling 10.25 with limited slip for $600. But didn't have the money.

 

Ended up finding a king pin high pinion 60 in a Pull-a-Part for a bit under $200. complete hub to hub. They seem to go for $600-$700 on 4x4 sites around here, but F250 owners wanting to get rid of their TTB front axle will pay upwards of $1K for them.

 

Rear axles are cheap and plentiful. 14 bolt is bullet proof, but a boat anchor unless shaved ($500 plus labor), D70, D80 are around the same size. D60 could be good depending on tire size, 2nd gen Sterling 10.25 is pretty good and supposedly has about the same ground clearance as a shaved 14 bolt. That's what I'm planning to mate my front 60 with. On a side note, Ballistif Fab makes a shave kit for a front high pinion 60 now.

 

Unless you already have tires for a 16" or larger wheel (needed to clear the brakes), rubber might cost you more than the axles. Unless you're a friend of mine who got a free set of 42" MT/Rs for helping Goodyear test them, then spent $7400 on a pair of Currie axles to mount them under his JK.

 

I would stay away from a front D44. The main weak points in my D30 are the unit bearings and the u-joints (and the flimsy sheet metal control arm mounts, but they are easily upgraded when one needs to be replaced). While a Ford D44 will get rid of the unit bearings, they still use the same size u joints. I have tried the $45 Alloy USA ones and even they don't stand up to a locker and 35" tires. And I'm not paying $300 for CTM.

[88SGTSlaughter]

Reading this made me think about putting 60's in mine. I alreadt have a 60 rear in garage and a few gear set choices and a new solid cover. hmmm I have to swap the axles anyways so why not right?

 

anyways I say go for it! 60's are like 200$ rear 6-700 front. Ill most likely go to pull a part one dsay for the front. little more work but an extra 500+$ I will save and have to spend on the rebuild.

[87Warrior]

Thanks for the info guys :) The plan formulating in my mind has selected 38" tires for the truck. I hope to find a solid set of axles within 6 hours from central KS.

 

I haven't shredded a Ujoint with my TJ on 35's yet with Alloy shafts/joints, but I drive it real carefully. I don't think that will be the case in the future as I have a yearning to go bigger and better ;)

[johnny quest]

check out my build thread. i got a 89 hp kp d60 for $600, and a 14 bolt for $300. factor in another 200-300 for brackets and you're in business. i went SOA in the rear and barely fit 37s without trimming. havent flexed it yet though. if you're goin tons, find the right ford d60. stay away from the dodge 60s and the chevys diffs are on the wrong side. once you have your 60, find a matching width 14 bolt. newer 14s come stock with ebrakes. feel free to ask more questions.

[COFFMAN]

Hey dudes a little of topic, but is there a HP D44 (front) correct width that is a direct bolt in for the MJ

Thanks in advance for any replys

[87Warrior]

Hey dudes a little of topic, but is there a HP D44 (front) correct width that is a direct bolt in for the MJ

Thanks in advance for any replys

Don't think so.

 

Closest thing is a Rubicon 44, but it is low pinion.

[COFFMAN]

Don't think so.

 

Closest thing is a Rubicon 44, but it is low pinion.

 

Thanks Warrior, The Rubicon you ref to is that a TJ, i don't think the TJ in Oz came with front D44 i Know they are in the rear.

Also JK has a front D44 but its to wide.

So if I'm going to the trouble of shorting a D44 housing, it would be best to use a F truck HP D44 with full floating front hubs.

Whats ya thoughts, i love input

[mvusse]

The regular TJ had a low pinion D30 front axle, but the TJ Rubicon came with a low pinion D44, selectable lockers front and rear a 4:1 low range instead of 2.72:1 and I believe a 241 transfer case instead of a 231.

 

Don't know if that model was sold oversees, though, and even used those axles go for $1K or more.

 

If you shorten the Ford 44 to use full size Wagoneer shafts you will be within 1/2" of stock width. I know someone who swapped in a Wagoneer D44, but it is low pinion.

[jpnjim]

XJs were built in South America with HP D44 fronts.

 

Correct width, with uca mount on the pumpkin & same unit bearing hubs as the typical XJ HP30.

 

A few years ago Currie bought up the existing left over stock of them to build & sell.

 

I know its on the other side of the planet,

but at least South America is on the right side of the equator for you,

might be worth looking in to.

[COFFMAN]

Awsome info Thanks, I have me hart set on a HP D44 and there is a bolt in one out there.

Now the trick is going to be putting my hands on it

[jpnjim]

Awsome info Thanks, I have me hart set on a HP D44 and there is a bolt in one out there.

Now the trick is going to be putting my hands on it

 

There is conflicting info on whether ALL XJs got the HP44s

or just certain years/certain packages,

but it was Venezuelan XJs that got them.

 

I guess a good place to start would be a junkyard in Venezuela.

:)

[87Warrior]

It looks like I may be in business. I picked up this complete HP ball joint Dana 60 yesterday. It made the '86 squat about 4". I also built a portable rack to make it easier to maneuver.

 

 

Lazy man's unloader:

[COFFMAN]

Lucky you, is the ball jointed better than a king pinned axel ?

What was it out of ?

Will you shorten it ?

Wish i had easy access to all this cool stuff

The only way i,ll get my HP D44 fornt is from Currie and most likely my rear $$$$$ :(

[87Warrior]

The KingPin is generally regarded as being a better axle. However, the ball joint axles are not considered to be bad and should suit my driving style just fine.

 

Came out of a '95 F350.

 

I will be running it full width.

 

You just need to jump the pond for a bit. There are quite a few HP 44's for sale out of the F250. Might be cheaper than Currie+Shipping.....

[johnny quest]

The KingPin is generally regarded as being a better axle. However, the ball joint axles are not considered to be bad and should suit my driving style just fine.

 

so true. i ended up with a KP cause thats what i found first, but the BJ60s are fine for 3/4's of wheelers. and those that swear by the KPs are usually such hardwheelers that the entire axle is custom parts anyway.

 

any plans for brackets? i went with the combo coil/shock/arm brackets from ballistic fab. nice product, and i personally didnt have issues, but alot of people have.

[87Warrior]

Those Ballistic brackets are at the top of my list. Seems like they should fit the bill perfectly.

[mvusse]

I got those brackets in the mail last week, should work just fine for me. After I get the pinion angle/caster angle figured out I'll weld them on and then go see what should work for the rest of the brackets (upper control arms and track bar. I will probably ditch my sway bar.

 

My axle tubes are 3.125", and those brackets are available for 3 and 3.25 (and 3.5?). Ballistic tried to sell me the ones for a 3.25" tube and told me to fill in the gap with weld. I insisted on the 3" ones and after 10 minutes total with a drum sander all four fit the axle tubes perfectly now.

 

The driver side bracket, the outside part will be welded to the tube, up against the leaf spring perch, the inside bracket I will have to cut to go onto the cast part (my welder says welding to the cast iron should not be an issue), and I will need to notch the spring pad a bit because of interference with the pumpkin. I saw a TJ with a D60 under it the other day and the springs ran in an S shape from the axle brackets being too far on the outside. I insist on having my springs run straight up and down, decided against cutting off 2-7/8" of the casting from the axle tube and don't want to mess with a truss that would probably cause more issue than it would solve for me. I may go with a partial truss that ties into the inner side of the bracket if I can make it work with the spring mount, but I'll see about that when I get there.

 

I looked into coil overs, but to much $$$ for me. I also looked into air shocks, but it would be trial and error to get them set up right which means I would have to lease a tank of high pressure nitrogen and buy a $450 regulator to put on it. Not gonna happen. If I had the money I would probably go one of those routes, though. Either of those I have no issues running them on an angle.

[Dirteatr717]

Glad to see another member on here stepping up! I picked up a fullwidth lp44 for 100 bucks filly dressed and a rear 60 for 80 without hubs... Most people around here are asking a bit more than by you guys... I've seen stock rear 60s with discs sell for 700 and KP 60s sell for 1500 easy.. What's your plan for the track bar mount and what kinda set up do you plan on running up front? 3 link?

[mvusse]

If I can get a partial truss working, definitely a 4 link. If not, I might go 3 link, or still keep it 4 link. One step at a time, start with the brackets I have now, figure out the rest when I get there. Same for the track bar mount: I'll figure it out when I get there. I need to do the steering first, then figure out where and how high to mount the track bar to match the drag link angle.

[87Warrior]

I anticipate going with a 3 link setup modeled after Claytons. Trackbar is one of those things I figure will need to be done once ride height/steering is figured out. But an integrated trackbar and UCA mount on the axle will probably be best along with some serious plate/beef at the frame end.

 

Toying with coil overs. I ran the tape measure across the front of the MJ and the 60 today and think I may have a decent idea that would allow me to use coils and shocks. But really, a set of good coils and.shocks will cost what a decent used coilover does. I will start a build once I get closer to actually starting the work.

[mvusse]

I'm using the same coils and shocks I already have. The coils have worked well for me, the shocks are lifetime warranty. I will net an additional one inch height off these brackets, though.

 

 

Keeping the same coil spacing on the axle will put the coils in the same place the Ford leaf springs used to sit. But the driver side leaf spring perch is cast as part of the pumpkin.

 

Coilover shocks can be angled out so they attach to the axle tube between the pumpkin and the inner C.

[Garvin]

I got my matched 60hp/10.25 from the local Jeep shop for $600 out of an '89. The brakes were in great condition as well as diff fluid was clean. I still replaced the front calipers and pads because they were dirt cheap. I sold the tires off of it for $200 so only really had $400 in the axle starting out so I couldn't turn down that deal (and I was sick of breaking the 44 that was in the rear of my Cherokee and I planned on running larger tires on the Comanche).

 

As said before, the 10.25 has the same ground clearance as a shaved 14 bolt plus has cast in trusses on the pumpkin. You can swap in a gen2 10.25 carrier into any 10.25 and 10.50 as long as you swap the bearings and races also to gen2.

 

I went with a true 3-link front since they flex a whole lot better than 4-links and radius arm setups. I'm running a small custom truss for the UCA mount since I ran it on the drivers side and and cut out a section of the tube. I have the combo Ballistic Fab mounts (LCA/shock/spring), Poly Performance generic control arm mount for the upper, Poly Performance axle side panhard mount (not a big fan of this one), and I believe Ballistic Fab frame side panhard mount (going to be swapping to a Barnes4wd one when I go high steer). I don't run a sway bar and the Jeep is stable enough to take 90 degree turns at 30 so I have no real motivation to run one right now.

 

I would stay away from welding to the cast section if you can avoid it. You will never get as strong as a weld to the cast as you will to the axle tubes and it's a royal pain to actually weld to it. You should be able to trim the cast back without taking off any of the plug welds and then you can lay a bead along the cast and tube just for good measure. I did this and bridged mainly just the pumpkin with my truss and laid a small bead on the top of the cast and the truss just for good measure (and they were resting on each others so figured I might as well) and plan on building a plate that ties into 3 or 4 of the differential cover bolts as a front support (probably don't need it but it'll make me feel better.

 

And since this hasn't been mentioned...You can run Cherokee/Comanche extended brake hoses with only very minor clearancing at the caliper side. I currently have the 6" over stock Crown ones on and had to remove about 1/16" from one side of the bottom mounting bracket.

[mvusse]

Plans may change as always, but the current plan for the driver side bracket:

 

Outside side of the bracket welded to axle tube up against the cast, possibly welded to cast as well.

Inside side of the bracket cut to snugly fit on cast and around edge of leaf spring perch, welded the whole way except on inside to leaf spring perch.

Drill and tap two holes in leaf spring perch.

Add a 1/4" plate in between inside and outside bracket, welded to both, bolted to leaf spring perch, possibly welded to it as well.

 

I don't see any reason why that would not be strong enough. If anything it might be over-engineered.

 

I'm a woodworker, not a metal worker. I can cut and grind steel, but don't have any welding skills to speak of. Both a professional welder (in his 60s) with a 460V stick welder and a friend of mine who is a certified welder with a 180A MIG say welding to the cast iron on this part of the axle is a non-issue.

 

After I get these brackets on I will look into the possibility of adding a partial truss tied into that bracket, over top of the pumpkin and to the tube on the other side to mount my upper control arm to if I decide to stick with a 4 link.