gavin8or Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Hey new Jeep owner, bought a 88 Comanche a few months ago, the guy I bought it from lives down the road and he's got a 92 with the same engine that I can use as a parts truck. I wrapped the 88 around an Oak trying to navigate a snowy corner today. Rad is toast, screwed up some other stuff. Probably easier to just try and put the starter and stuff in the 92 and get er running again right? Well started looking at the 92 see what it's missing. Turns out the guy he bought it from took it into a Jeep place to get a new clutch a few years back. The garage couldn't ever get it to work, the new one couldn't be bled. So they just took the lose and got it out of the shop. So now it drives just... you have to shift without the clutch. Question is: Can I take the clutch that works out of the 88 and put it in the 92? The 92 is in much better condition anyways, plus it has a 5 speed. I've read that Cherokee and Commanche parts are interchangeable. What about between a 92 commanche and a 88 comanche? Details: Both have the same engine (4.0 litre Throttle body, but the 88 has the 4 speed manual transmission and the 92 has a 5 speed manual transmission. P.S. I probably have enough mechanical experience to do this if I can figure out whether it can be done or not/what I would need to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejndssn Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I Believe we are talking about a 4cyl engine here :dunno: was not mentioned in your post. we will need additional information, i'm speculating that one of these is and AX4{88} and the other is AX5 or AX15(92) Not sure as to what the shop has done with the 92 :dunno: would like to know if the we are speaking about same engine types here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete M Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 He says they are both 4.0Ls. Hopefully he'll read my other post and check to see what on earth trans he has in the 88. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejndssn Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 thanks pete missed the last part :oops: now the real question is the 88 i though the 4sp was in the 4 cyl and the 88 would have the puke joe with the 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete M Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Yup, that is the question of the day. :popcorn: No 4 speed manual trans was ever offered behind the 4.0L and the AX-4 won't bolt to the 4.0L. So is it a Peugeot with a broken 5th? Some really old 4 speed that used to be behind a different Jeep 6 cylinder? :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavin8or Posted January 23, 2007 Author Share Posted January 23, 2007 Thanks for the answers guys, I'm waking up at 4AM tomorrow morning for the purpose of asking the former (2 owners ago) proprietor of the truck. I'm very sure that it is a 4-speed not a 5 with a broken gear. And I'm very sure that it's not a straight six engine. So, the improbable has happened: it is a 4.0L 4cylinder with a 4-speed. But it might not be a AX4. Either way I will know the whole story by 6AM tomorrow morning. Thank you guys for helping me figure out what questions to ask him! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 He says they are both 4.0Ls. Hopefully he'll read my other post and check to see what on earth trans he has in the 88. Yeah, he says they are both 4.0L but he also says both are throttle body injected and one is a 4-speed -- neither of those was was ever available on the 4.0L so something is messed up. I'm very sure that it is a 4-speed not a 5 with a broken gear. And I'm very sure that it's not a straight six engine. So, the improbable has happened: it is a 4.0L 4cylinder with a 4-speed. But it might not be a AX4. I don't think anyone makes a 4-liter, 4-cylinder engine, and I know Jeep never did. The Comanche/Cherokee 4-cylinder is 2.5 liters and that's the ONLY 4-cylinder engine that was ever offered in those models. It is NOT a 4.0L 4-cylinder. Why would you put an old clutch into a vehicle that has a new clutch in it? The problem with the '92 isn't the clutch, it's that the numbwits who did the job didn't know how to bleed the hydraulics. It can be difficult, but it can be done. Take the '92, bleed the clutch, and drive it like you stole it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavin8or Posted January 23, 2007 Author Share Posted January 23, 2007 Morning everyone, I crawled under both of them this morning (with 6 inches of snow underneath, let's just say this was a category 3 PITA) to look at the transmission. They both looked the same, both looked like the picture of the AX15 which Pete posted in the other forum (I'm going to only post on this forum for now on, probably easier). So... does that mean that they both have AX15s? Is it even remotely possible that the 88 actually has a AX4 that look identical (I checked, there was not perceptible difference in size between the two) which someone has managed somehow to bolt to it? I find that hard to believe, considering the history of the vehicle. Probably easier to believe that it is also a AX15 which does not go to fifth for some reason anymore :( Also have to apologize, I was wrong as to the displacement of the engine, I knew that they were both 4 cylinders (heh spent some time screwing around with the distributer before I realized I needed a new ignition computer for the 88) but for some reason said (without knowing) that they were 4Litres. That is wrong: the 88 is for sure a 2.5Litre, and 92 is either a 2.5 or 2.8, but my understanding is that they had the exact same engine, so it would have to be a 2.5. You guys are right: I really should try and get this thing (tranny on the 92) to bleed. I spoke with the former owner of the 92 and he said that it drove awesome at any speed, and he loved it despite the problems he had with the clutch. He also said that it would work for a day if you poured clutch fluid in and pumped it a few times, but that I really should try and get it to bleed. I'm phoning the shop right now to find out why they gave up on it... story was they were using a GM reverse bleeder on it and everything. Also, that way when I have time this summer I can buy a new rad for the 88 and get er running again... who knows maybe I could get all 5 gears back... but that might take some time with the tranny on my bench. Anyways, thanks once again for the info, it seems like I have 2 2.5L 4 cylinder engines and both of the trannys are AX... hopefully they are both AX15s but I don't know what a AX4 would look like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete M Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Ahhh, if they are both 2.5L 4-cylinders, then the 4 speed is an AX-4 and the 5 speed is and AX-5. :D One mystery solved. Now you just need to track down why they couldn't fix it in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavin8or Posted January 23, 2007 Author Share Posted January 23, 2007 I will call them and ask them what they tried. Perhaps it is that they didn't remove the slave cylinder as part of the process. Which I understand (from jage) is necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oizarod115 Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 you mentioned the PO of the 92 said if you dump clutch fluid into it itll work for a day... thats not a bleeding problem, but a leak somewhere. AX15s didnt come behind 4cylinders in 88, not sure about 92 but I'm pretty sure one will be AX4 (4speed) and the other AX5. radiators only take about an hour or two to change... and that's on the trail. one of the easiest cooling system jobs cause there's no gasketing to change, but if you change it buy some LARGE screw-style hose clamps, because the OEM ones are a bear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I will call them and ask them what they tried. Perhaps it is that they didn't remove the slave cylinder as part of the process. Which I understand (from jage) is necessary. It depends what your definition of "remove" is. "Remove" is not synonymous with "replace." The hydraulic slave cylinder/release bearing assembly bolts to the bell housing. The bell housing comes off the engine with the tranny, so you can say that the slave cylinder is "removed" to replace the clutch. However, that doesn't mean that they then did the logical thing and put in a new slave cylinder while they had things opened up. IMHO it would take a total moron to get it apart and NOT replace the slave cylinder ... but there are a few morons out there, and anything is possible. The other possibility, since as already noted the "works for a few days if you pour in fluid" sounds a lot like a leak, is that the master cylinder is bad and they didn't replace that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oizarod115 Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 The other possibility, since as already noted the "works for a few days if you pour in fluid" sounds a lot like a leak, is that the master cylinder is bad and they didn't replace that. agreed, and keep in mind that to have a bad master cylinder just requires not having any clutch, sometimes it has leaks and other stuff too but when my clutch master died it was just no clutch... system held fluid fine, started up in gear worked all right just NO clutch, went out in a matter of days. so it could be more than one thing. maybe swap the 88s MC with the 92's (only takes bout 15-20 minutes plus bleeding it so maybe an hour) ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jage Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 I will call them and ask them what they tried. Perhaps it is that they didn't remove the slave cylinder as part of the process. Which I understand (from jage) is necessary. It depends what your definition of "remove" is. "Remove" is not synonymous with "replace." The hydraulic slave cylinder/release bearing assembly bolts to the bell housing. The bell housing comes off the engine with the tranny, so you can say that the slave cylinder is "removed" to replace the clutch. However, that doesn't mean that they then did the logical thing and put in a new slave cylinder while they had things opened up. IMHO it would take a total moron to get it apart and NOT replace the slave cylinder ... but there are a few morons out there, and anything is possible. The other possibility, since as already noted the "works for a few days if you pour in fluid" sounds a lot like a leak, is that the master cylinder is bad and they didn't replace that. Lets keep in mind, since we're doing tandem threads, that I was talking about the external slave which is what my AX5 had. The AX4 I replaced had an internal slave, and it never crossed my mind to specify. Also when my master was leaking for the PO it leaked from the push rod all over the fuse box and rotted the contacts. Just something to check inside the cab. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oizarod115 Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 jage- i figured you were talkin about an external slave model, but that didnt happen til 94 for the AX15... and I'm not sure about AX4/5 but i'd assume the same year. its all good :wrench: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jage Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 Nope, my 86 2.8L AX5 has an external slave. The 88 2.5 AX4 had an internal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 Yeah, Jeep used an external from 84 thru 86, then they switched over to the infernal slave. This dual thread thing is getting confusing. I'm going to close this one. Please continue the clutch discussion on gavin8or's other thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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