starkizer Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Purchased my 89 Pioneer and when I pulled into the drive way the clutch hits the floor and I'm dead in the water. Turns out theres no fluid in the master cylindar. Got that filled up and nothing, come to find a major leak from the slave. Which of course is internal. So a month or so later when I finally have money to do something about it I called around, got somebody that would fix it, everythings going great, they came out and towed it to there shop and everything. Real happy with there work. Long story short, my baby sat outside for 6 days while they worked on it. Ended up replacing the slave, clutch plate, pressure plate, pilot bearing, all of it inside the tranny. I figured I should do it while it was out so I only had to pay once. Finally got the call saying she was done so I went to pick her up. On the way home I got stuck in the middle of an intersection and could not shift into first to save my life. Took it back to them figuring they screwed something up. They called the next morning said it was done. Come to find out all they did was leave the cap off the master overnight. Months later and I had no problems, out of the blue there it is again, can't shift into gear. With my foot on the clutch as soon as I take my foot of the brake I'm moving, so the clutch isnt disengaging. Took it back to them again and they said it was my master had a very slow leak. At this point I'm so mad at them I would rather have a trained monkey do the work so I elected to take it else where. I ended up doing the master myself yesterday and am having the same problem today. I'm wondering if they screwed something up, maybe put the plate in backwards or bent one of the pressure plate fork things.... I don't know! So here's the problem in detail now that you know the back story. :wall: Heat is the only consistancy, I can go a few minutes or a few months without a problem. It seems when the whole thing gets hot enough, I can't shift any more. I have been stuck countless times in the middle of traffic and the only way to shift is to shut the truck off, shift and start it again. As soon as I let off the brake I move again with the clutch pedal fully pressed. All 5 gears and reverse, but first and second seem to be the hardest to get into. Also ive notice while coming to a stop sign if I can force it into gear you can hear the clutch spinning real fast. I'm at my witts end and can't afford another 600 bucks to drop the transmission but do NOT want to take it back to them again. Any suggestions would be AWESOME! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimoshel Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 When these events occur, does your master cylinder have fluid or is it dry? You did check, didn't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starkizer Posted June 28, 2011 Author Share Posted June 28, 2011 Yes, Master has fluid in it. Only ever had to refill when I bled the system right after installing the new master. Otherwise I only ever leaked before I had this local place replace everything inside. Thank you for the reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Did anyone replace the line/hose between the master and slave cylinders? It's a steel tube on each end, but the middle portion is a rubber flex line, like the brake system flex lines at each axle. If that's the 20+ year old original, it may have gotten soft and be swelling up under pressure rather than transferring full pressure to the slave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starkizer Posted June 28, 2011 Author Share Posted June 28, 2011 Eagle, That is brilliant. Thats about the ONLY thing not replaced so far. I can't see anything thats wet from the naked eye but if its small enough to not cause a problem all the time it could be small enough I wouldnt notice. Do I have to drop the tranny to get to where that line connects into the slave? And any chance Autozone would carry the part? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
64 Cheyenne Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 If you went months and no problems I doubt that there was anything physically messed up by the shop. My best guess is the quality of parts that were used either by you (Master Cylinder) or them (Slave Cylinder) I've heard many times on this board especially when it comes to internal slaves, to only use the Daimler Chrysler assembly's. Do I agree with this, the cost no, quality yes. Why? because currently I'm limping around in the 88 with a cheap internal slave that leaks down (+/- 4k miles). I tried saving money, now I get to pull the tranny again. No more internals for me, I have an external in queue for next time. I wish I could say the line was my problem, guess I'll take a closer look, hope that it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zagscrawler Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Eagle makes a very stong point but before you replace that line i would grab it and have a friend depress the clutch a few times and see if you feel it acctually swells. I have not had my hand into a MJ master yet but some of the others ive seen apart move more fluid then i think the inner liner of the factory clutch line can swell with out bursting or showing signs of serious fatigue. I could be wrong but if you feel it swell then you know what your up against and if it doesn't then you need to see where the fluid is acctually going if your master is still in working order. FYI most soft line high preasure lines twitch and contort a bit when preasure is applied but they should never acctually swell. I worked with comercial hydraulics for many years before i became a private mechanic and have much, IMO LOL, incite to high preasure systems. Good luck friend and let us hear how things go. :wrench: Also if i had to be honest i would not think that the soft line would even twitch if the slave is not bound up and working proper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starkizer Posted June 28, 2011 Author Share Posted June 28, 2011 Will check the line per your suggestion. Was told by a friend that the system needs to be bled a lot before it will work correctly, any thoughts on bleeding? I wouldn't think it would be any different than bleeding brakes or any other systems. Thanks all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starkizer Posted June 29, 2011 Author Share Posted June 29, 2011 Haven't done anything to it yet, but this evening my baby is shifting like it just rolled off the show room floor. Don't know what's up but I pray it stays that way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zagscrawler Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 that is strange..... Something else to consider is maybe the pilot bearing in the flywheel is acting up and sometimes gets bound up to you input shaft on the trans. Or you clutch disc doesn't slide around on the input shaft splines freely :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starkizer Posted July 2, 2011 Author Share Posted July 2, 2011 Took the cap off the master to check fluid lvl, as soon as air got to it I saw bubbles. Shifting problems for a day, now its shifting like a dream again. Think I've got a gremlin. :rant: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zagscrawler Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 sounds like you might be pulling air in somewhere....check all your conections to make sure they are all tight. I'm assuming because you haven't said you are leakin fluid that you are NOT leaking fluid. If that is the case then you are in need of a serious bleeding... If that does not stop the bubbles then i would think you have a faulty master and it is pulling in air as you let off the pedal. Also a side not when you install your brake lines don't just tighten them till they stop....tighten them till they stop then back it off and retighten it again and note if it went further this time. It should of by the way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starkizer Posted July 2, 2011 Author Share Posted July 2, 2011 It only bubbled when I took that cap off. Just for a sec. I've taken it off again and no bubbles. I replaced the master because of this problem so I really, really hope its not bad. Far as I can tell everything is dry. Gonna try bleeding some more this weekend. It's been to Dang hot to do any work lately. Will also check the lines. I appreciate everyone's suggestions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starkizer Posted July 10, 2011 Author Share Posted July 10, 2011 A quick update. The things been shifting like a dream except and night and when my wife is riding which is usually at night. One of the two is my gremlin. So anyhow... buddy of mine said its my synchronizer. I don't know anything about that do a few questions. What is it, do I need to drop the tranny and how do I fix it. Also was wondering if the fluid in the tranny itself would effect anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zagscrawler Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 The syncro's are infact inside the trans and you have to split the case to replace them. It is not that simple of a job and would not recomend getting inside your trans with out experianced help. As for the fluid it is very important to be running the proper fluid (factory recomended or something recomended by some of the more experianced wrenches on this forum). The wrong type or low level of fluid can and will affect the way the syncros are working and cause serious damage to the rest of the internals as well. Just a note, the syncros don't acctually consist of very many moving parts and i find it hard to believe that they will just SOMETIMES ACT UP on you, normally with syncro problems they start to wear out and have a consistant issue. I am new to the comanche world and have yet to fill or swap fluids in my trans so i can't recomend the proper fluid, sorry about that. Good luck and keep me posted on what you find, you have got me all curious now lol. :wrench: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starkizer Posted July 10, 2011 Author Share Posted July 10, 2011 Good advice about the synchros. It is weird that it doesn't act up all the time. There wouldnt be anything non tranny related that would cause my problem. Ie my differential fluid is crap and I've got something leaking from where the drive shaft goes into the diff. Leaking all over the gas tank. Anyway. I'm sure its got something to do with the clutch. Just don't know what. Something must have been done wrong but would anyone take your truck back to the same shop three times. I didn't think so. Clutch plate, pressure plate, pilot, slave, master its all new. I just don't get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starkizer Posted September 15, 2011 Author Share Posted September 15, 2011 Just wanted to update. I took her in to the local Chrysler dealership after still having problems. They changed out the slave and master (again) and changed a few lines. so far everyting is working just fine. Now I just need to change all the fluids down there. (Both Diffs, transfer and tranny etc.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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