Body work questions

[BPB]

I am doing body work for the first time on my subi. What are some tricks that I should know? I have about 30 1/4" holes to fill from removing trim that I don't like. What should I know about sanding? What grits should I use? What speed should I use my 7" orbital sander at? This is not my forte.

[codybutz]

If your just filling trim holes remove the paint around each hole to the size of a quarter. then take the rounded side of a ball hammer or a body hammer will work too and give it a little hit right over each hole so that each trim hole will now have a quarter size dent. you don't want a huge dent just about an 1/8" deep. make sure each dent has a nice tooth to it so that you can slap some all-metal or body filler in it. then get a nice straight sanding block and take all the filler down till its smooth with the rest of the panels. this is how i was taught to shave and remove all the trim on cars.

 

make sure you clean the surface before you use any filler or it will not grip the panel and you'll have a weak bond.

 

 

you can also just weld each hole up but if you don't hav a welder or you don't know what your doing you can easily warp the panels.

 

let me know if you hav any other autobody questions, I'm an ASE cert. body guy

[jeepcoma]

What speed should I use my 7" orbital sander at?

 

You should set that for 0 RPM and leave it there. This is strictly hand sanding only. Attack that thing with a power sander and you won't believe how much you can screw stuff up in so short a time.

 

I'd also practice with whichever filler you get ahead of time so you can get a feel for it. Unless you get some pre-measured kits, you'll have to mix on your own, and depending on your filler-to-catalyst ratio you'll have varying cure times. For fixing many small holes, you'll probably want to start with small batches and just doing one or two at a time; otherwise you'll end up mixing a big batch of goop that will be difficult to work with from the start and the properties will be changing as you work.

 

Probably the most helpful thing you could do is head over to a body shop and see if you can watch some guys do it. You'll learn far more in five minutes of watching someone than you can by reading how to do it. Even if you end up paying for an hour of labor in order to watch them fill in a few holes for you while you watch and can ask a few questions, it will be a cheap lesson in how to do it right, just simply to see the quantities they use, how they mix it, and the technique they use to apply and shape it.

[jtdesigns]

take some 320 paper and lightly sand the small spots. Get you some Polyester Glazing Putty and a razor blade. Use the razor blade to spread the putty on lightly. sand smooth, prime, block, search "guide coat", fill with primer surfacer, sand til its all straight, seal, color coat, clear coat.

 

don't make the dent bigger,,, thats just not really logical.......

 

 

http://www.ehow.com/video_2200685_apply-guide-coat-car-restoration.html

http://www.evercoat.com/productDetail.aspx?pID=29

[jbhill]

weld the holes or don't waste your time filling them with filler, they will fall out eventually.

[jtdesigns]

weld the holes or don't waste your time filling them with filler, they will fall out eventually.

:agree: I didnt realize they were drilled holes .. I was thinking they were dents like hail damage.

[brdhntr]

a simple fix for small holes is the old method of body repair. use lead. heat the spot, put warm lead over it. do that a couple times until it's filled. then sand and your set. you can get lead pretty easily and it's cheap. that's a quick, cheap, and simple fix for little holes like that. :thumbsup:

[jtdesigns]

a simple fix for small holes is the old method of body repair. use lead. heat the spot, put warm lead over it. do that a couple times until it's filled. then sand and your set. you can get lead pretty easily and it's cheap. that's a quick, cheap, and simple fix for little holes like that. :thumbsup:

 

Thats an OLDDDDD trick... I've never even seen it done, but heard of the old timers doing it in seems and such.. How old are you brdhntr? I didnt know you could get that kind of lead any more unless you get it out of an old battery.

[BPB]

God this is a super long process. Luckily I have a week off. I f%ed some stuff up bad before I posted. I tried using a flap wheel on my grinder to take off pin striping. I have so much sanding in my future. I appreciate all the advice I can get. I will look into the lead.

[brdhntr]

a simple fix for small holes is the old method of body repair. use lead. heat the spot, put warm lead over it. do that a couple times until it's filled. then sand and your set. you can get lead pretty easily and it's cheap. that's a quick, cheap, and simple fix for little holes like that. :thumbsup:

 

Thats an OLDDDDD trick... I've never even seen it done, but heard of the old timers doing it in seems and such.. How old are you brdhntr? I didnt know you could get that kind of lead any more unless you get it out of an old battery.

 

 

ha ha!!!!!!! :rotfl2: :rotfl2: :rotfl2: :rotfl2:

 

i'm actually only 39. i have worked on alot of cars over the year and found a few tricks. one of those tricks is how to do body work on very old vehicles the way they used to do it. braze welding and using lead are just a few of the old timer tricks some of us forget about. these tricks worked for body work and customization for years. some custom build shops still use these methods. you can still get lead. i have used shot (for reloading shotgun shells) on several occasions. it melts down nicely and is pretty good lead. you can even buy some wheel weights if you want. i think the best lead comes from fishing weights and the lead shot. :thumbsup:

 

hey, thanks for making me feel old though. :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

[dasbulliwagen]

I would think that on todays thin sheetmeta cars, that using lead to fill holes would cause major panel warpage. Thats the reason they don't use it anymore, that and that its poisonous to use, touch and breathe the vapors. By the time you get the panel hot enough to melt the lead youll have more problems than you started with. And while I'm not currently a body man, I did go to school for it and would like to think I know a little of what I'm talking about. The spot weld with MIG is the best thing you can do to fill the holes. They make copper backing plates now just for that purpose if you can reach the backside, though for little spots like that some pennies would probably work too. Good luck with it! :thumbsup:

[jbhill]

done use pennys, they have a galvanized coatings, i like nickels the best... lol. wow a flap wheel to take off the pinstripe?.... maybe you should get one of those "bodywork for beginners" books b4 you just jump in head first and cause yourself more headache.

[BPB]

done use pennys, they have a galvanized coatings, i like nickels the best... lol. wow a flap wheel to take off the pinstripe?.... maybe you should get one of those "bodywork for beginners" books b4 you just jump in head first and cause yourself more headache.

 

Headache already caused. after 4 hours I have fixed most of the damage caused by the flap wheel. What I have learned so far... Palm sander makes a weird texture. Foam sanding blocks are made for drywall and hand rails, not cars. The only think that works is hand sanding multiple times. This is more work then this $100 car deserves. it is going to look BA when it's done. After two days 1/4 of the car is primed. I have been going with the ball hammer method.

[jbhill]

ball hammer method? hit it till your tired and walk away?

[brdhntr]

actually lead is so soft it melts at very low temps. welding a spot creates much more heat and possible panel warping. the thinner sheetmetal is actually the reason such a method will work. the vehicles were originally made of pretty thin metal and foreign cars kept the thin metal for a long time. braze welding was developed to keep from going through thin sheetmetal and keep the heat down to prevent warping. lead is the same idea. it takes very little heat to melt the lead so very little heat is transfered to the sheetmetal. as long as the metal is prepped properly with some sanding or grinding, it's quick, easy, and very little risk of warping.

 

you can even use a simple propane torch for filling with the lead. it doesn't take much heat. it takes such little heat you can actually use it without discoloring the paint.

 

when you weld with a stick, mig, or tig welder, you are heating the steel enough to melt it. steel melts at a much high temp and that increases the risk of warpage. there are many custom auto shops that still use lead and braze welding. if you don't believe me, watch speed tv. they have some shows on building and restoring cars. many of the shops they use are still using some of the old methods.

 

don't get me wrong, i do most body work with a mig (i hope to get a tig this summer though). but it's not always the best choice. when i'm working on thin metal, i do use braze welding and lead.

 

all i can say is that we all have our own ways of getting the job done. ;)

[DirtyComanche]

You can buy 'lead free' lead filler now. I forget who makes the kit... But w/e. It's non-toxic, works exactly like lead, but you can grind or sand it without needing a mask + tons of cleaning to avoid poisoning. The kit includes a couple wood paddles, some wax, and a bunch of rods of the 'lead'.

 

Personally, I just bondo the fawk out of cheap vehicles. I know I will either sell them or junk them before it's a problem. Yes, I'm the 'stupid PO that didn't know how to do bodywork'.

[BPB]

Personally, I just bondo the fawk out of cheap vehicles. I know I will either sell them or junk them before it's a problem. Yes, I'm the 'stupid PO that didn't know how to do bodywork'.

I like this idea. I have decided to go with flat od green. This won't show the dents and poor bondoing as bad.I also decided that I am keeping the lower trim with the bigger holes, just too much work.