Jeep J20 axles

[MWinland]

Would they be worth the effort? I'm running a hp30 w/ alloy shafts and a D44 right now on 31" mud kings. I was thinking it might be fun to pull the J20 axles and build them during the winter. They're out of a post-80 J20 so the D44 has the driver diff and the rear is a D60FF. The idea of having an 8-lug, almost-full-width MJ on 36" tires sounds awesome.

[cracker]

I don't beleive any effort to convert the MJ/XJ to full width is worth the effort. The rear dana 60 on the J20 is still 30 spline (the same as our Dana 44s).

 

If you can find one, if you can get a 1970-ish J20 rear, it has a WMS of a mid size (65") and comes in a non C-clip 35 spline axle with 5 x 5.5 bolt pattern. A strong stock axle wiht a reasonable bolt pattern and not too wide. Just need to find a front to match.

[MrFreeze5]

Its a good option if its available. Its as good(or possibly better) than some other factory axle combos since it is a bit narrower than your average 67-69" "fullwidth." Its still a low pinion front and and yes, a 30spl rear, but so is just about any other factory 60 you get. Its well known that a stock trim dana 60 isnt all that, but it has the same potential as any other rear 60 to be built to the hilt. The real downside to this setup is that the J trucks were not that common and finding axles is not an everyday thing like waggy's, GMs, Fords, and Dodges. I can find a 44/60 from any of those trucks in less than a day, but a J truck takes some more effort, and occasionally more $$.

 

Even though the 60 shaft is the same diameter as the front 44, the rear axle does not carry any weight, it just transfers torque. So just in the design it is stronger. And if you do break a rear axleshaft, your wheel will not fall off. Granted, if you don't have a locker youre still stuck, but at least your wheel didnt fall off! Plus the opposed roller bearing setup is nice and easy to service. Later you can bore the spindles, upgrade to 35 spline and call it good, but even in stock form, it will be an upgrade for whatever came in an MJ. But you should strongly consider a disc brake swap. It seems obscene to swap in so much weight with the stock drums considering how heavy the axle is.

 

Another disadvantage, is due to their rarity, junkyard spare axle shafts arent as easy to find, same as full donor axles. But as axles, theyre a good combo to start with.

 

If I can find a J20 dana 60 I will jump on it for my Willys Wagon project. I'm building it with only parts that came in some model of Jeep at some point(4.0/AX-15/dana 300/44/60) and would love to get a J truck rear 60 to keep it "authentic."

 

i saw go for it. On 36s, youll be fine, but you will have a decent platform worth upgrading in the future if needed.

[cracker]

So just in the design it is stronger.

 

In 'design' it IS stronger.

 

In reality, it is not.

 

Of all the 30 spline Dana 44 shafts I have personally seen break, never have I don't recall the flange of the axle shaft ever failing. Keep in mind it tapers up pretty thick for the bearing to be pressed onto the shaft. The thin section near the splines is usually what goes. This is IDENTICAL on both the Dana 60 full float and the Dana 44 semi float so there is basically no gain (othe than weight) to go that route.

 

This is usually how the 60s and 44s shafts fail:

 

 

FWIW, the budget 'Pirate' crowd who are into big power, big rocks, and big tires, all run to either 14 bolts or Dana 70s because of the significant shaft strength and they skip right over the Dana 60. They also run Dually axles because the width can be as little as 63" and they can run the axle stock on 40" tires for $150 out of a junk yard ;)

[jimoshel]

I don't beleive any effort to convert the MJ/XJ to full width is worth the effort. The rear dana 60 on the J20 is still 30 spline (the same as our Dana 44s).

 

If you can find one, if you can get a 1970-ish J20 rear, it has a WMS of a mid size (65") and comes in a non C-clip 35 spline axle with 5 x 5.5 bolt pattern. A strong stock axle wiht a reasonable bolt pattern and not too wide. Just need to find a front to match.

 

All the J20's and any of the 3/4 ton trucks I've ever seen were 8 lug. FC excepted.

I have several J20 axle assemblies as well as a couple J20's if anybody really wants one.

[Automan2164]

 

All the J20's and any of the 3/4 ton trucks I've ever seen were 8 lug. FC excepted.

I have several J20 axle assemblies as well as a couple J20's if anybody really wants one.

 

I'll take a J-20 delivered to Harvard, Il. Do you deliver?

 

Rob L. :brows:

[jimoshel]

 

All the J20's and any of the 3/4 ton trucks I've ever seen were 8 lug. FC excepted.

I have several J20 axle assemblies as well as a couple J20's if anybody really wants one.

 

I'll take a J-20 delivered to Harvard, Il. Do you deliver?

 

Rob L. :brows:

 

Normally no. However for you and a cold one I'll think about it. :cheers:

[cracker]

I don't beleive any effort to convert the MJ/XJ to full width is worth the effort. The rear dana 60 on the J20 is still 30 spline (the same as our Dana 44s).

 

If you can find one, if you can get a 1970-ish J20 rear, it has a WMS of a mid size (65") and comes in a non C-clip 35 spline axle with 5 x 5.5 bolt pattern. A strong stock axle wiht a reasonable bolt pattern and not too wide. Just need to find a front to match.

 

All the J20's and any of the 3/4 ton trucks I've ever seen were 8 lug. FC excepted.

I have several J20 axle assemblies as well as a couple J20's if anybody really wants one.

 

I've got one of the 5 x 5.5 semi float ones in my garage ;)

 

It actually says 60-2 on the casting as well. They are not easy to come by. We found it for $100 with a WMS/WMS measurement of 65.5".

 

If you want I can take a picture of it tomorrow for you.

 

DD on pirate runs one as well:

 

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showpost ... stcount=13

[jpnjim]

I don't beleive any effort to convert the MJ/XJ to full width is worth the effort. The rear dana 60 on the J20 is still 30 spline (the same as our Dana 44s).

 

If you can find one, if you can get a 1970-ish J20 rear, it has a WMS of a mid size (65") and comes in a non C-clip 35 spline axle with 5 x 5.5 bolt pattern. A strong stock axle wiht a reasonable bolt pattern and not too wide. Just need to find a front to match.

 

All the J20's and any of the 3/4 ton trucks I've ever seen were 8 lug. FC excepted.

I have several J20 axle assemblies as well as a couple J20's if anybody really wants one.

 

I've got one of the 5 x 5.5 semi float ones in my garage ;)

 

It actually says 60-2 on the casting as well. They are not easy to come by. We found it for $100 with a WMS/WMS measurement of 65.5".

 

If you want I can take a picture of it tomorrow for you.

 

DD on pirate runs one as well:

 

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showpost ... stcount=13

 

 

Jeep standardized the FS truck line in 1974,

& went to open knuckle ft 44's + FF 30 spline 60's on their 3/4 ton's like everyone else.

 

 

They also adopted the J10/J20 designations that same year (1974).

 

So technically speaking, J20's were all 8 lug, with 30 spline FF60.

 

The 3/4 ton 70-73 FSJ's with 5 lug 35spline 60's were J4000's.

 

I daily drove one for most of the 1990's, and kept the axle when I cut it up.

 

 

What I know about them:

 

Thinner casting/tubes than typical D60's

Wheel bearings are like $100+ each now

Since the pumpkin is offset, you could chop the long side down to take a short shaft, and have something really close to 60" wide when you're done.

Axle end pattern is a circular 6 hole style, same as 6 hole D44 front spindles (weird, I know).

Almost all of them were factory geared at either 4.10, or 4.88's.

12" drums look huge, but fit inside every 15" wheel I ever tried.

 

(& in response to Cracker's link):

The only 35sp SF Ford 60's I ever heard of were C-clip axles,

but I'm not sure if they made a C-clip D60 Detroit back then (or even now :hmm: ).

[cracker]

I don't beleive any effort to convert the MJ/XJ to full width is worth the effort. The rear dana 60 on the J20 is still 30 spline (the same as our Dana 44s).

 

If you can find one, if you can get a 1970-ish J20 rear, it has a WMS of a mid size (65") and comes in a non C-clip 35 spline axle with 5 x 5.5 bolt pattern. A strong stock axle wiht a reasonable bolt pattern and not too wide. Just need to find a front to match.

 

All the J20's and any of the 3/4 ton trucks I've ever seen were 8 lug. FC excepted.

I have several J20 axle assemblies as well as a couple J20's if anybody really wants one.

 

I've got one of the 5 x 5.5 semi float ones in my garage ;)

 

It actually says 60-2 on the casting as well. They are not easy to come by. We found it for $100 with a WMS/WMS measurement of 65.5".

 

If you want I can take a picture of it tomorrow for you.

 

DD on pirate runs one as well:

 

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showpost ... stcount=13

 

 

Jeep standardized the FS truck line in 1974,

& went to open knuckle ft 44's + FF 30 spline 60's on their 3/4 ton's like everyone else.

 

 

They also adopted the J10/J20 designations that same year (1974).

 

So technically speaking, J20's were all 8 lug, with 30 spline FF60.

 

The 3/4 ton 70-73 FSJ's with 5 lug 35spline 60's were J4000's.

 

I daily drove one for most of the 1990's, and kept the axle when I cut it up.

 

 

What I know about them:

 

Thinner casting/tubes than typical D60's

Wheel bearings are like $100+ each now

Since the pumpkin is offset, you could chop the long side down to take a short shaft, and have something really close to 60" wide when you're done.

Axle end pattern is a circular 6 hole style, same as 6 hole D44 front spindles (weird, I know).

Almost all of them were factory geared at either 4.10, or 4.88's.

12" drums look huge, but fit inside every 15" wheel I ever tried.

 

(& in response to Cracker's link):

The only 35sp SF Ford 60's I ever heard of were C-clip axles,

but I'm not sure if they made a C-clip D60 Detroit back then (or even now :hmm: ).

 

Yup, that is it. J4000? Interesting.

 

The drums are really odd too. We are going to convert it to disc anyhow but they are like 12" x 2".

 

Ford continues to build semifloat 60s in their full size vans. (I have one of those in the garage too) It is C-Clip as well. The one out of a 2005 van I have is 8 x 6.5 bolt pattern as well.

[Incommando]

The SF D60's are called D60-2's. and could also be found under hemi & track-pak equipped Mopars for a few years. They have the 5x4.5 BP, but are not economically feasable...

 

There are several versions on the D70: find a SRW D70HD for the ultimate. You can file the housing down and run a D60 cover, so it hangs no lower than a D60. The 14ff is silly strong, too, but needs a lot of cutting unlesss you want to run 38's and get less ground clearance than 35's on a D60.

[jpnjim]

The SF D60's are called D60-2's. and could also be found under hemi & track-pak equipped Mopars for a few years. They have the 5x4.5 BP, but are not economically feasable...

 

 

Pretty feasible for me. ;)

 

you can tell it's a B-body Mopar 60 because of it's narrow width (59.5"), cast/finned 11"x2.5" drums, and 5 on 4.5" wheel patturn.

Oh, and that it's only a couple inches off the ground with 32's. :rotfl2:

 

The Mopar pinion snubber bolt pattern is visible in this pic.

 

 

It's probably worth more than my whole Jeep,

but it was only $495 out of a race car when I bought it in the 1990's

(with 4.56's/Powerlock & 23sp 1.5" shafts)

 

I swapped Moser 35spline shafts in ~2000, and a Detroit a year after that.

[Incommando]

Nice score!

 

I am not 100% in agreement with the D60 being the same strength as a D44. This is not the common belief in the drag racing world where shafts and destroying diff's is potentially fatal, not just a nuisance. I was running 10.30's on a stock D60-2 under a lightened '70 'cuda.

 

I agree that D44/D60 J20 axles sets are much more pricey than some other set-ups. People must like the mid-width....

[MrFreeze5]

Alright, I just gotta say, you guys SUCK. Now I want a 60-2. I was unaware of that axle and it is exactly what I need for my 58 Willys Wagon project. Just what I need, another rare axle hunt to fit my build. Geez, you guys are not helping my affliction here.

[jpnjim]

Alright, I just gotta say, you guys SUCK. Now I want a 60-2. I was unaware of that axle and it is exactly what I need for my 58 Willys Wagon project. Just what I need, another rare axle hunt to fit my build. Geez, you guys are not helping my affliction here.

 

Just chop down a FF D60, and run SF 35spline shafts.

 

The big problem with both the 60-2's listed above (J4000 & Mopar automotive) is the wheel bearings.

 

J4000 bearings are unobtanium, and $100+ smackers a piece.

 

Mopar automotive bearings are decent tapered rollers, and easy to find,

but they require preload, and a center-button between the ends of the two axle shafts to preload the shafts against.

Running an aftermarket differential (posi, locker, spool, etc) can complicate fitting the center-button.

The easy way out is to run 'Green' bearings,

they're sealed ball bearings that don't require preload, but greatly reduce the load carrying ability of the axle (not a good thing with a D60 in a pickup truck).

 

 

If you start with a FF 60, chop to fit, and bang on some big 9" Ford housing ends you'll get the width you want, a stronger center section, thicker tubes, cheap to find, strong wheel bearings, and a good selection of Ford brakes to boot.

 

You do have to worry about properly aligning the ends, and buying shafts.

I think I got my Moser shafts for ~$300.

That's not much more than you'll pay for a set of bearings & seals for the J4000 axle.

[MrFreeze5]

Alright, I just gotta say, you guys SUCK. Now I want a 60-2. I was unaware of that axle and it is exactly what I need for my 58 Willys Wagon project. Just what I need, another rare axle hunt to fit my build. Geez, you guys are not helping my affliction here.

 

Just chop down a FF D60, and run SF 35spline shafts.

 

The big problem with both the 60-2's listed above (J4000 & Mopar automotive) is the wheel bearings.

 

J4000 bearings are unobtanium, and $100+ smackers a piece.

 

Mopar automotive bearings are decent tapered rollers, and easy to find,

but they require preload, and a center-button between the ends of the two axle shafts to preload the shafts against.

Running an aftermarket differential (posi, locker, spool, etc) can complicate fitting the center-button.

The easy way out is to run 'Green' bearings,

they're sealed ball bearings that don't require preload, but greatly reduce the load carrying ability of the axle (not a good thing with a D60 in a pickup truck).

 

 

If you start with a FF 60, chop to fit, and bang on some big 9" Ford housing ends you'll get the width you want, a stronger center section, thicker tubes, cheap to find, strong wheel bearings, and a good selection of Ford brakes to boot.

 

You do have to worry about properly aligning the ends, and buying shafts.

I think I got my Moser shafts for ~$300.

That's not much more than you'll pay for a set of bearings & seals for the J4000 axle.

 

I know I can mod another axle to work, but I am trying to build my Willys with only parts that came in a Jeep at some point or another. Ive got a ford 9" that would be perfect for the truck, but it never came in a Jeep, so I won't use it for this project. It will only be running 35's with a 4.0, so super strength isnt an issue, but it needs to be bigger than a rear 44 and 5 lug.

 

If I were to do a FF 60 for some reason, I would just end up putting 5 lug hubs on it and keeping it FF, but no 8 lug on the Willys.

[cracker]

Alright, I just gotta say, you guys SUCK. Now I want a 60-2. I was unaware of that axle and it is exactly what I need for my 58 Willys Wagon project. Just what I need, another rare axle hunt to fit my build. Geez, you guys are not helping my affliction here.

 

Just chop down a FF D60, and run SF 35spline shafts.

 

If you start with a FF 60, chop to fit, and bang on some big 9" Ford housing ends you'll get the width you want, a stronger center section, thicker tubes, cheap to find, strong wheel bearings, and a good selection of Ford brakes to boot.

 

You do have to worry about properly aligning the ends, and buying shafts.

I think I got my Moser shafts for ~$300.

 

Best advice on this thread :thumbsup:

 

This is what I did on my MJ and what I do for folks on the side out here.

 

 

The only different suggestion I would say IS to use an alignment bar and aligning the ends on the tubes in alignment with the carrier bearings. The reason I say this is I have NEVER seen a perfectly straight Dana 60 of the many I have done. They all seem to be 'off' a tad.