First Comanche: 87' SporTruck

[Kyleinreallife]

Hey all,

 

Quick and to the point. I picked up a Comanche and love it, runs well (159k miles). Just redid the brakes, threw a new muffler on and got some minor electrical/functional work done (blinkers, mirrors, etc.) Small gear oil leak on the rear of transmission and small oil leak from, hopefully, the valve cover.

 

It's got the 2.5L 4banger, I eventually want to get the straight six or if possible, a turbo diesel in it.

 

Obviously I've got to work from the rear forward. It's got baby Dana 30s which need to be upgraded to 44s. After that's is where you all come in. I'm new to this and am open to suggestion for upgrades.

 

I'm not very familiar with all this but from what I understand it's not much different from the xjs.

 

I want to get her somewhere in the middle of the road between crawler and jeepspeed. She's going to be my daily so it's needs to stay street legal.

 

I'm not a mechanic, but I am mechanically inclined, I'm a welder. So any suggestions or questions are appreciated, thanks!

 

 

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[Kyleinreallife]

I guess more to the point, I'm looking to create a work/build plan and any help offered will be appreciated!

 

 

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[DirtyComanche]

The platform does share a lot with the XJ Cherokee.  Up front they're pretty similar.  The rear is obviously not, most importantly for you the suspension and axle mounting are not the same.

 

Your rear axle is a D35 (I'd assume at least) and the front will be a HP (high pinion) D30.  The D35 is a turd, the D30 is okay within limits.

 

You should figure out exactly what you intend to do with the truck, and how big of tires you want, etc, before doing anything else.  A crawler can be pretty hardcore, same with Jeepspeed, however both could be built using a D30 front (most Jeepspeed stuff retains it due to rules, AFAIK).  The rear really is useless, but the options of swapping it should be tailored around determining if the front axle is to be swapped or not.

 

Most common rear axle swaps are the XJ/MJ D44, the later XJ Chrysler 8.25, and the Ford Explorer 8.8.  Only the MJ D44 will bolt in, all the others will need minor fab work (remove and install new spring perches, shock mounts, etc).  These swaps are well documented and you can have the axle set up to go in the same day you pull the old one out.

 

Swapping the front is a whole 'nother ball game.  You need to have decent fabrication skills, or at the least be wiling to drop money on a bracket kit and know or pay for a decent welder/fab guy to put them on.  There also isn't a lot of clearly good options for a front axle.  The Wagoneer D44 is common, but it's a bit of a turd being LP (low pinion), and it's not an ideal width IMHO, plus it is 6x5.5 bolt pattern (can be converted to others, but can not be made into the stock 5x4.5 pattern).  I think for a D44 I'd look for at some of the older F-truck axles.  However, for the work to swap one in, you're already a long ways to swapping in a D60 for more bang for the buck.  However, going to a D60 front has downsides, it's big and heavy and only justified with much larger tires.  Also to consider, the older D44s aren't a huge upgrade over say a newer D30 out of a JK, as Dana made some major general improvements to their axles when they went to the JK stuff (and some other newer stuff, like the Superduty D60).

 

Or just straight up pay to play and buy a crate axle set up to go in an XJ/MJ/TJ.  The economics of this are generally pretty terrible though.

 

Like I said, figure out what you want the truck to do, and then it can be answered as to of what options are probably best for you.

[DirtyComanche]

Just realized you said you are a welder, I read that as 'not a welder' the first time.  So you should have no issues doing the work required to swap the rear, and I'm sure you could figure out how to stick a bracket kit on for the front.

[HOrnbrod]

Who drove the white 61 Dodge Dart into your house?
 

[Kyleinreallife]

Who drove the white 61 Dodge Dart into your house?

 

Hahaha my grandpa turned the trunk of one into a bench. Working tail lights and all

 

 

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[HOrnbrod]

That's very cool.   :cheers:

[Comacho]

that's nice

[Kyleinreallife]

The platform does share a lot with the XJ Cherokee. Up front they're pretty similar. The rear is obviously not, most importantly for you the suspension and axle mounting are not the same.

 

Your rear axle is a D35 (I'd assume at least) and the front will be a HP (high pinion) D30. The D35 is a turd, the D30 is okay within limits.

 

You should figure out exactly what you intend to do with the truck, and how big of tires you want, etc, before doing anything else. A crawler can be pretty hardcore, same with Jeepspeed, however both could be built using a D30 front (most Jeepspeed stuff retains it due to rules, AFAIK). The rear really is useless, but the options of swapping it should be tailored around determining if the front axle is to be swapped or not.

 

Most common rear axle swaps are the XJ/MJ D44, the later XJ Chrysler 8.25, and the Ford Explorer 8.8. Only the MJ D44 will bolt in, all the others will need minor fab work (remove and install new spring perches, shock mounts, etc). These swaps are well documented and you can have the axle set up to go in the same day you pull the old one out.

 

Swapping the front is a whole 'nother ball game. You need to have decent fabrication skills, or at the least be wiling to drop money on a bracket kit and know or pay for a decent welder/fab guy to put them on. There also isn't a lot of clearly good options for a front axle. The Wagoneer D44 is common, but it's a bit of a turd being LP (low pinion), and it's not an ideal width IMHO, plus it is 6x5.5 bolt pattern (can be converted to others, but can not be made into the stock 5x4.5 pattern). I think for a D44 I'd look for at some of the older F-truck axles. However, for the work to swap one in, you're already a long ways to swapping in a D60 for more bang for the buck. However, going to a D60 front has downsides, it's big and heavy and only justified with much larger tires. Also to consider, the older D44s aren't a huge upgrade over say a newer D30 out of a JK, as Dana made some major general improvements to their axles when they went to the JK stuff (and some other newer stuff, like the Superduty D60).

 

Or just straight up pay to play and buy a crate axle set up to go in an XJ/MJ/TJ. The economics of this are generally pretty terrible though.

 

Like I said, figure out what you want the truck to do, and then it can be answered as to of what options are probably best for you.

So would be the benefit of a 35 out of a jk vs a 44 from an older ford?

 

 

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[Kyleinreallife]

Also, would you happen to know about compatibly on the jk front end for the mj? Is there a particular year I should look for?

 

 

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[DirtyComanche]

 

The platform does share a lot with the XJ Cherokee. Up front they're pretty similar. The rear is obviously not, most importantly for you the suspension and axle mounting are not the same.

 

Your rear axle is a D35 (I'd assume at least) and the front will be a HP (high pinion) D30. The D35 is a turd, the D30 is okay within limits.

 

You should figure out exactly what you intend to do with the truck, and how big of tires you want, etc, before doing anything else. A crawler can be pretty hardcore, same with Jeepspeed, however both could be built using a D30 front (most Jeepspeed stuff retains it due to rules, AFAIK). The rear really is useless, but the options of swapping it should be tailored around determining if the front axle is to be swapped or not.

 

Most common rear axle swaps are the XJ/MJ D44, the later XJ Chrysler 8.25, and the Ford Explorer 8.8. Only the MJ D44 will bolt in, all the others will need minor fab work (remove and install new spring perches, shock mounts, etc). These swaps are well documented and you can have the axle set up to go in the same day you pull the old one out.

 

Swapping the front is a whole 'nother ball game. You need to have decent fabrication skills, or at the least be wiling to drop money on a bracket kit and know or pay for a decent welder/fab guy to put them on. There also isn't a lot of clearly good options for a front axle. The Wagoneer D44 is common, but it's a bit of a turd being LP (low pinion), and it's not an ideal width IMHO, plus it is 6x5.5 bolt pattern (can be converted to others, but can not be made into the stock 5x4.5 pattern). I think for a D44 I'd look for at some of the older F-truck axles. However, for the work to swap one in, you're already a long ways to swapping in a D60 for more bang for the buck. However, going to a D60 front has downsides, it's big and heavy and only justified with much larger tires. Also to consider, the older D44s aren't a huge upgrade over say a newer D30 out of a JK, as Dana made some major general improvements to their axles when they went to the JK stuff (and some other newer stuff, like the Superduty D60).

 

Or just straight up pay to play and buy a crate axle set up to go in an XJ/MJ/TJ. The economics of this are generally pretty terrible though.

 

Like I said, figure out what you want the truck to do, and then it can be answered as to of what options are probably best for you.

So would be the benefit of a 35 out of a jk vs a 44 from an older ford?

 

 

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D30, not 35.

 

The only clear benefits, IMHO, would be overall less weight, perhaps somewhat less complexity of the install, better ground clearance, and better u-joints/outer axle shafts.

 

The JK D30 gear set was upgraded over the prior D30 in regards to how they cut the gears, and the pinion size and bearings.  This should make the gear set close to the regular D44 in strength, although this is inferred as the way Dana rates input torque limits makes it hard to know, however there's lots of JKs running around with 35-37" tires on their D30 fronts with minimal failures (after they do some other basic upgrades).

 

The outer stub shafts on a regular D44 are a puny 19 spline.  This is intentional, as they intended for any failure to occur in the outer shaft or hub.  On a JK D30 they're either 30 spline or 32 spline (the JK D44 are 32 spline for sure).  A XJ/MJ D30 they're 27 spline.  The old style D44 is a clear downgrade in this department, but it can be upgraded to 30 spline outs BUT you need to buy either Yukon Hardcore Hubs or drive flanges.  Most of the aftermarket hubs for the old style D44 suck too (you listening Warn?  With your 'premium' overpriced garbage hubs :thwak: ).

 

U-joints on the old style D44 are a 760X type (or 297X, same thing but old style).  A XJ/MJ D30 91+ (I believe) are also the 760X.  The JK uses a larger joint, the 7331X, IIRC.  It will not fit in the old style D44, and it is a clear upgrade from the 760X.  That said, you can run some high-zoot aftermarket u-joints in an old style D44 or D30 to 'solve' this weakness, but they tend to be labour intensive (bushing style, must grease daily), and the ears of the yokes will just stretch out and fail anyways because there wasn't space to make them large enough in the old D44/D30.

 

Ball joints are fairly comparable between all of the above.  There is aftermarket solutions for all of them too.  Short of going to a D60 or bigger there isn't a clear winner.

 

The old style D44 does have better inner Cs.  Thus bracing or trussing the XJ/MJ/JK axles is always a good idea.  The outer knuckles on many D44s are crap though, and the JK ones will be better.  Later XJ D30 ones are better even.

 

The JK knuckle already allows for proper crossover steering without milling/buying high steer arms.

 

The JK axle tubes are weaker than most older D44s, but it's not so clear cut.  Ford used a lot of different types, the 78/79 HP D44 with the cast wedges was terrible, and the JK stuff is probably stronger stock vs stock.  But there was some F250 HD D44s that used a 3x.500" axle tube, IIRC, I had one of them, and that's in D60 strength territory, BUT it's also D60 weight at that point.  In the middle of this is most of the Ford HP D44s and the Wagoneer LP D44, which were 2.75x.375" tubes, which is IMHO a good compromise, better than the JK stuff stock vs stock, but if wheeled hard I would still recommend a truss.  I would sleeve and truss a JK axle if running one (the sleeves are cheap and easy to install, I would plug weld them in more places than the instructions say to though).

 

Honestly, decide what you want the truck to do, tire size, wheeling type, lockers or not, gonna jump it, etc.  There is no clear answer on any of this, but without defining the intended use and needed strength there is no answer at all.